1 00:00:04,070 --> 00:00:01,730 this program is brought to you by the 2 00:00:07,400 --> 00:00:04,080 genesis communications network a world 3 00:00:17,130 --> 00:00:07,410 leader in talk radio since 1998 visit 4 00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:29,520 [Music] 5 00:00:39,100 --> 00:00:35,010 you're in the para cast the gold 6 00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:39,110 standard of paranormal radio now here's 7 00:00:45,619 --> 00:00:43,410 gene Stein we're hoping on this week's 8 00:00:48,470 --> 00:00:45,629 episode of the para cast that Chris 9 00:00:54,380 --> 00:00:48,480 O'Brien's connection difficulties are 10 00:00:57,080 --> 00:00:54,390 behind him well yes we do I had a tech 11 00:01:00,380 --> 00:00:57,090 over here and evidently this particular 12 00:01:02,750 --> 00:01:00,390 leg of their network has a lot of noise 13 00:01:04,759 --> 00:01:02,760 on it Nathan's spent the last week and a 14 00:01:08,060 --> 00:01:04,769 half two weeks still trying to track it 15 00:01:09,500 --> 00:01:08,070 down and I said well you know why would 16 00:01:11,330 --> 00:01:09,510 there be noise and he said well the 17 00:01:14,690 --> 00:01:11,340 monsoon may have done something we may 18 00:01:15,170 --> 00:01:14,700 have had a cable get some water in it 19 00:01:17,350 --> 00:01:15,180 somewhere 20 00:01:20,210 --> 00:01:17,360 he says but most of the time it's people 21 00:01:23,140 --> 00:01:20,220 wiring up their own you know putting 22 00:01:25,670 --> 00:01:23,150 splitters in and wiring up cables to 23 00:01:28,250 --> 00:01:25,680 sort of bootleg cables to other rooms 24 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:28,260 and stuff and they don't do it right and 25 00:01:32,630 --> 00:01:29,850 that creates noise so they're they're 26 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:32,640 slowly trying to whittle it down to 27 00:01:37,910 --> 00:01:35,130 which section of the this particular 28 00:01:40,490 --> 00:01:37,920 part of the grid that that's creating 29 00:01:42,080 --> 00:01:40,500 the problem as now I'm five up and 30 00:01:43,970 --> 00:01:42,090 thirty down so I'm doing pretty good 31 00:01:45,500 --> 00:01:43,980 well you're sounding pretty good which 32 00:01:47,780 --> 00:01:45,510 is fine of course we will have Skype 33 00:01:50,090 --> 00:01:47,790 connections with Kathleen Mardon and 34 00:01:52,220 --> 00:01:50,100 Stanton Friedman later we'll have to see 35 00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:52,230 what kind of speeds they get the key to 36 00:01:57,590 --> 00:01:54,930 Skype if any of you have using Skype the 37 00:01:59,210 --> 00:01:57,600 key is your upload speed most of the 38 00:02:00,980 --> 00:01:59,220 connections managed in the cloud but 39 00:02:04,310 --> 00:02:00,990 your upload speed has to be good enough 40 00:02:07,310 --> 00:02:04,320 and it's not that much it's less than 41 00:02:09,050 --> 00:02:07,320 make up is sufficient to get you good 42 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:09,060 performance is just voice it's not video 43 00:02:16,580 --> 00:02:12,170 if you're doing video all bets are off 44 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:16,590 exactly so before I upload that conflict 45 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:19,170 in the desert video I'll make sure my 46 00:02:24,649 --> 00:02:21,690 upload speed is cranking along at five 47 00:02:27,920 --> 00:02:24,659 Meg so we can't wait to see that by the 48 00:02:31,490 --> 00:02:27,930 way I did hear from the publicist who is 49 00:02:35,379 --> 00:02:31,500 managing the book by Gary Lachman mm-hmm 50 00:02:39,470 --> 00:02:35,389 good okay finally we hope to have him on 51 00:02:40,980 --> 00:02:39,480 early mid-october and just to point out 52 00:02:43,950 --> 00:02:40,990 Gary Lachman was a found 53 00:02:46,920 --> 00:02:43,960 member of a rock group blondie he left 54 00:02:49,590 --> 00:02:46,930 the group before they had all their big 55 00:02:51,420 --> 00:02:49,600 hit records which sometimes happens 56 00:02:54,680 --> 00:02:51,430 although I guess he rejoined them later 57 00:02:57,750 --> 00:02:54,690 for a reunion tour but he's also as a 58 00:03:00,480 --> 00:02:57,760 result of that a member of the Rock and 59 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:00,490 Roll Hall of Fame but also very much 60 00:03:05,550 --> 00:03:02,530 involved in writing about the occult 61 00:03:09,150 --> 00:03:05,560 which is why he will be here indeed 62 00:03:12,570 --> 00:03:09,160 he may be a listener because the one 63 00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:12,580 thing I noticed here is that his 64 00:03:18,450 --> 00:03:14,770 publicist says he's really anxious to 65 00:03:20,430 --> 00:03:18,460 come on the show alright yeah so that's 66 00:03:24,090 --> 00:03:20,440 very fascinating he wrote a book by the 67 00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:24,100 way about Colin Wilson yes yes one of my 68 00:03:28,470 --> 00:03:25,690 favorite authors I mentioned this I 69 00:03:31,170 --> 00:03:28,480 think a couple of weeks back that you 70 00:03:33,740 --> 00:03:31,180 know his books the mysteries of the 71 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:33,750 occult beyond the occult 72 00:03:40,980 --> 00:03:38,290 just one of the best writers I think in 73 00:03:44,160 --> 00:03:40,990 my my vast library of books just an 74 00:03:45,990 --> 00:03:44,170 incredibly gifted writer of course his 75 00:03:49,980 --> 00:03:46,000 first book that really put him on the on 76 00:03:54,090 --> 00:03:49,990 the map was the outsiders and really 77 00:03:57,810 --> 00:03:54,100 gave him an instant push out into the 78 00:04:00,450 --> 00:03:57,820 into the spotlight as a writer you know 79 00:04:04,050 --> 00:04:00,460 he's over his lifespan he must have 80 00:04:07,730 --> 00:04:04,060 written 20 30 books I've only got 5 I 81 00:04:12,150 --> 00:04:07,740 think but one of my favorite authors 82 00:04:15,150 --> 00:04:12,160 discussing discussing kind of though the 83 00:04:19,580 --> 00:04:15,160 weird in-between places in the subjects 84 00:04:21,539 --> 00:04:19,590 that we cover and his work especially 85 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:21,549 investigating and researching the occult 86 00:04:28,650 --> 00:04:25,570 is is extremely revealing I think and 87 00:04:30,630 --> 00:04:28,660 and I really highly recommend it the 88 00:04:34,170 --> 00:04:30,640 power of belief is a powerful thing and 89 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:34,180 and I don't think that there's any one 90 00:04:42,030 --> 00:04:38,610 that really has covered occult subjects 91 00:04:43,890 --> 00:04:42,040 in such a literary fashion and just a 92 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:43,900 pleasure to read and I'm really looking 93 00:04:49,230 --> 00:04:46,690 forward to speaking with Gary who is one 94 00:04:54,659 --> 00:04:49,240 of the experts on the role of the occult 95 00:04:58,560 --> 00:04:54,669 in in popular music and you know week 96 00:04:59,820 --> 00:04:58,570 it may not quite be paranormal but to 97 00:05:02,939 --> 00:04:59,830 the religious right and the 98 00:05:06,030 --> 00:05:02,949 fundamentalist it's definitely it's 99 00:05:07,590 --> 00:05:06,040 definitely paranormal so it'll be fine 100 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:07,600 getting Gary on the show and I'm looking 101 00:05:12,840 --> 00:05:10,210 forward to it and by the way neighbors 102 00:05:15,150 --> 00:05:12,850 we will spend a few moments for him to 103 00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:15,160 reminisce about the world of rock and 104 00:05:20,430 --> 00:05:16,810 roll I mean we can't get him away 105 00:05:21,750 --> 00:05:20,440 without that you know of course now this 106 00:05:23,969 --> 00:05:21,760 week we're gonna have a more traditional 107 00:05:29,390 --> 00:05:23,979 look at UFOs we're going to talk about 108 00:05:33,330 --> 00:05:29,400 UFOs debunkers government misinformation 109 00:05:36,420 --> 00:05:33,340 disclosure distortion and something 110 00:05:38,909 --> 00:05:36,430 called conspiracy con men I think we've 111 00:05:40,439 --> 00:05:38,919 run across a couple of those so taking 112 00:05:43,050 --> 00:05:40,449 that very traditional approach of course 113 00:05:45,090 --> 00:05:43,060 is Stanton Friedman and Kathleen Martin 114 00:05:47,129 --> 00:05:45,100 and by the way speaking of sky 115 00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:47,139 connections before we're having a little 116 00:05:53,990 --> 00:05:50,530 fun trying to get Stan to work on Skype 117 00:05:56,580 --> 00:05:54,000 well he's moving into the 21st century 118 00:05:59,520 --> 00:05:56,590 yeah well he had some computer problems 119 00:06:02,940 --> 00:05:59,530 too he tells me so now turns out the 120 00:06:06,540 --> 00:06:02,950 seams of Stan has not necessarily the 121 00:06:08,730 --> 00:06:06,550 newest computer on the planet and maybe 122 00:06:11,129 --> 00:06:08,740 not necessarily the newest version of 123 00:06:13,529 --> 00:06:11,139 Skype on the planet so I say at this 124 00:06:16,710 --> 00:06:13,539 point the odds are 50/50 as to whether 125 00:06:20,339 --> 00:06:16,720 we talked to Stan on skype or the 126 00:06:22,379 --> 00:06:20,349 telephone in case the book here is not a 127 00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:22,389 bunch of case histories although you get 128 00:06:29,700 --> 00:06:26,650 cases in it it's a look at the history 129 00:06:32,490 --> 00:06:29,710 of the UFO cover-up according to the 130 00:06:34,860 --> 00:06:32,500 investigations that Kathleen and Stanton 131 00:06:36,570 --> 00:06:34,870 have done and that might be interesting 132 00:06:38,400 --> 00:06:36,580 in and of itself because he brings up 133 00:06:42,870 --> 00:06:38,410 some interesting characters along the 134 00:06:45,930 --> 00:06:42,880 way of course people like dr. Menzel dr. 135 00:06:50,820 --> 00:06:45,940 Condon Philip Glass did you ever read 136 00:06:54,810 --> 00:06:50,830 Philip Glass Chris I did it was at the 137 00:06:58,080 --> 00:06:54,820 1998 international MUFON symposium he 138 00:07:03,270 --> 00:06:58,090 was toddling around tottering around 139 00:07:04,779 --> 00:07:03,280 with a walker and I guess he had he had 140 00:07:06,219 --> 00:07:04,789 left 141 00:07:09,459 --> 00:07:06,229 one of the President of Maine 142 00:07:11,019 --> 00:07:09,469 presentations and kind of with a look of 143 00:07:14,709 --> 00:07:11,029 disgust on his face I forget who 144 00:07:17,019 --> 00:07:14,719 actually was speaking and I saw him kind 145 00:07:18,549 --> 00:07:17,029 of you know making his way down the 146 00:07:20,019 --> 00:07:18,559 court there's nobody around it was just 147 00:07:22,749 --> 00:07:20,029 a few people but kind of milling about 148 00:07:24,369 --> 00:07:22,759 and so I went up to him put my my arm 149 00:07:27,939 --> 00:07:24,379 around his shoulder kind of scared him a 150 00:07:30,909 --> 00:07:27,949 little bit I said here is my favorite 151 00:07:33,489 --> 00:07:30,919 Bulldog and he looked at me and he's 152 00:07:34,959 --> 00:07:33,499 like well who the hell are you and I 153 00:07:39,820 --> 00:07:34,969 said I'm not gonna tell you because then 154 00:07:41,860 --> 00:07:39,830 you'll be a bulldog on me interesting I 155 00:07:44,230 --> 00:07:41,870 met a couple of times in the early years 156 00:07:47,260 --> 00:07:44,240 and he was good friends with Jim Mosely 157 00:07:49,299 --> 00:07:47,270 no accounting for taste on either side 158 00:07:51,790 --> 00:07:49,309 of that equation I always thought that 159 00:07:53,499 --> 00:07:51,800 Phil class was kind of a nasty character 160 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:53,509 and I'm gonna ask to stand about the 161 00:07:59,110 --> 00:07:55,490 insights but I'll give you one more 162 00:08:03,969 --> 00:07:59,120 insight and that is back in the 1960s I 163 00:08:06,309 --> 00:08:03,979 saw dr. Menzel appear on a TV show 164 00:08:07,779 --> 00:08:06,319 called by the way open minds no 165 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:07,789 relationship of course to the current 166 00:08:18,279 --> 00:08:14,810 open minds but he was debating UFOs with 167 00:08:19,629 --> 00:08:18,289 John fuller this is before interrupted 168 00:08:23,290 --> 00:08:19,639 journey I think was incident that 169 00:08:30,010 --> 00:08:23,300 excerpt was the book about the Exeter 170 00:08:32,409 --> 00:08:30,020 New Hampshire UFO case and manzil looked 171 00:08:35,680 --> 00:08:32,419 terrible and I don't know if it was the 172 00:08:38,319 --> 00:08:35,690 age or something but fuller suddenly 173 00:08:39,909 --> 00:08:38,329 starts asking him questions and it 174 00:08:43,089 --> 00:08:39,919 looked like Menzel was gonna have a 175 00:08:45,879 --> 00:08:43,099 heart attack on the air this was live 176 00:08:48,639 --> 00:08:45,889 television remember this was just in the 177 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:48,649 early days of using tape and on Sundays 178 00:08:54,129 --> 00:08:51,410 they would often have live shows and 179 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:54,139 that was one of the classic moments I 180 00:08:58,900 --> 00:08:55,730 don't know if there's any recording of 181 00:09:04,210 --> 00:08:58,910 it anywhere but if you see it dr. Howard 182 00:09:07,050 --> 00:09:04,220 Menzel John fuller open minds TV show 183 00:09:10,150 --> 00:09:07,060 from channel 4 the NBC station New York 184 00:09:12,759 --> 00:09:10,160 classic so one of the interesting 185 00:09:15,059 --> 00:09:12,769 revelations in this book is that for a 186 00:09:18,730 --> 00:09:15,069 period I guess about 30 years 187 00:09:21,940 --> 00:09:18,740 dr. Menzel had connections with an 188 00:09:25,260 --> 00:09:21,950 intelligence agency supposedly he's a 189 00:09:27,670 --> 00:09:25,270 civilian astronomer a civilian scientist 190 00:09:32,139 --> 00:09:27,680 but he's got these questionable 191 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:32,149 affiliations well I didn't know that so 192 00:09:37,660 --> 00:09:34,130 again the book is called fact fiction 193 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:37,670 and flying saucers and somehow we will 194 00:09:44,650 --> 00:09:40,610 connect with Stanton Friedman and try to 195 00:09:46,660 --> 00:09:44,660 get his issues resolved I think we need 196 00:09:50,620 --> 00:09:46,670 to call the space people for this Chris 197 00:09:53,740 --> 00:09:50,630 I don't think they're gonna be very 198 00:09:58,300 --> 00:09:53,750 helpful no no he wants to expose them he 199 00:10:08,170 --> 00:09:58,310 wants to reveal who they are okay with 200 00:10:10,750 --> 00:10:08,180 gene and Chris you're in libertas the 201 00:10:13,210 --> 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para cast comm just to let 314 00:14:36,810 --> 00:14:34,660 your listeners know we finally gave up 315 00:14:39,030 --> 00:14:36,820 on trying to get Skype to work on 316 00:14:41,700 --> 00:14:39,040 Stanton Friedman's computer because the 317 00:14:46,980 --> 00:14:41,710 version he has is too old to allow for 318 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:46,990 group conversations the his computer was 319 00:14:51,870 --> 00:14:49,330 built by the way it was the one they 320 00:14:58,380 --> 00:14:51,880 used to control the Roswell spaceship 321 00:15:01,770 --> 00:14:58,390 right I didn't know that there's long 322 00:15:03,270 --> 00:15:01,780 version I knew I had an old version of 323 00:15:04,740 --> 00:15:03,280 Skype but I didn't know there were newer 324 00:15:07,380 --> 00:15:04,750 versions that I needed to worry about 325 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:07,390 sorry about that it's not your fault 326 00:15:11,490 --> 00:15:09,250 there are always newer versions the 327 00:15:13,110 --> 00:15:11,500 problem with Skype and other apps is 328 00:15:16,110 --> 00:15:13,120 that the newer versions come out every 329 00:15:18,060 --> 00:15:16,120 other day or something and therefore if 330 00:15:19,980 --> 00:15:18,070 you don't just keep checking it 331 00:15:23,100 --> 00:15:19,990 you'll probably be behind the eight-ball 332 00:15:24,870 --> 00:15:23,110 it's nothing that you did we should tell 333 00:15:27,150 --> 00:15:24,880 you something that we've done we've set 334 00:15:29,280 --> 00:15:27,160 up a special way to hear this show 335 00:15:31,620 --> 00:15:29,290 without the commercials and without a 336 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:31,630 dish hopper or any of those tricks and 337 00:15:36,630 --> 00:15:33,970 that is if you become a member of the 338 00:15:39,870 --> 00:15:36,640 para cast + @ + doctor para cast com 339 00:15:42,150 --> 00:15:39,880 that's PL us thought the para cast come 340 00:15:44,220 --> 00:15:42,160 for a low subscription fee we offer the 341 00:15:47,790 --> 00:15:44,230 exclusive after the para cast podcast 342 00:15:48,930 --> 00:15:47,800 and all sorts of other goodies plus dr. 343 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:48,940 Peric ascom 344 00:15:53,780 --> 00:15:51,970 as it's very obvious the guests are 345 00:15:55,370 --> 00:15:53,790 people I've known for a long time Stan 346 00:15:57,410 --> 00:15:55,380 and Friedman I don't know would must go 347 00:16:02,720 --> 00:15:57,420 back to the 70s when I first ran into 348 00:16:03,710 --> 00:16:02,730 you Stan you were just a lad at the time 349 00:16:07,970 --> 00:16:03,720 but right 350 00:16:13,190 --> 00:16:07,980 you see to everybody Stan meets their 351 00:16:15,980 --> 00:16:13,200 young he was 90 years old when the 352 00:16:18,620 --> 00:16:15,990 Roswell spaceship crashed and Kathleen 353 00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:18,630 Martin and Chris O'Brien who was just a 354 00:16:25,660 --> 00:16:22,890 mere lad compared to us right well I'm 355 00:16:27,920 --> 00:16:25,670 getting long in the tooth myself so I 356 00:16:34,610 --> 00:16:27,930 got involved in all this stuff at a 357 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:34,620 fairly late age 35 I was only 13 well I 358 00:16:39,620 --> 00:16:37,050 mean I've always had an interest I mean 359 00:16:42,170 --> 00:16:39,630 I'm an experienced or my first guest 360 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:42,180 kind of rude awakening happened when I 361 00:16:46,580 --> 00:16:44,610 was seven and it wasn't by choice either 362 00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:46,590 I might add so I've always had an 363 00:16:51,020 --> 00:16:48,690 interest but in terms of you know 364 00:16:54,230 --> 00:16:51,030 writing articles reading you know 365 00:16:55,730 --> 00:16:54,240 writing books appearing on shows and 366 00:16:59,120 --> 00:16:55,740 that sort of thing that happened rather 367 00:17:01,430 --> 00:16:59,130 late yes I was a late comer on that I'd 368 00:17:04,430 --> 00:17:01,440 read my first book at 24 but I didn't 369 00:17:08,840 --> 00:17:04,440 get my first lecture until I was 33 so 370 00:17:12,290 --> 00:17:08,850 they're slow to develop let's look at 371 00:17:13,790 --> 00:17:12,300 this book that you stand and Kathleen 372 00:17:15,380 --> 00:17:13,800 have come out with fact fiction and 373 00:17:17,330 --> 00:17:15,390 flying saucers but first let me give you 374 00:17:19,430 --> 00:17:17,340 the subtitle because I think it tells 375 00:17:22,330 --> 00:17:19,440 you a lot what's going on here the truth 376 00:17:25,700 --> 00:17:22,340 behind the misinformation distortion and 377 00:17:28,790 --> 00:17:25,710 division by debunkers government 378 00:17:31,790 --> 00:17:28,800 agencies and conspiracy con men before 379 00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:31,800 we go into the larger focus of the book 380 00:17:37,250 --> 00:17:35,250 you use the term conspiracy con men or 381 00:17:38,870 --> 00:17:37,260 would be con person now what do you 382 00:17:42,740 --> 00:17:38,880 think stand because of our politically 383 00:17:46,910 --> 00:17:42,750 correct nature oh well really can't be 384 00:17:50,410 --> 00:17:46,920 that the world's a neutral place we use 385 00:17:54,500 --> 00:17:50,420 men often to mean everybody don't we 386 00:17:56,930 --> 00:17:54,510 okay now a conspiracy con man could you 387 00:17:59,330 --> 00:17:56,940 give us maybe an example of a kind of 388 00:18:01,760 --> 00:17:59,340 person who would be someone like that 389 00:18:04,490 --> 00:18:01,770 and obviously it's not just believing a 390 00:18:06,730 --> 00:18:04,500 conspiracy it's because you have the 391 00:18:09,700 --> 00:18:06,740 intent to deceive 392 00:18:12,340 --> 00:18:09,710 you have a classic individual that you 393 00:18:14,950 --> 00:18:12,350 can cite or there's so many we realize 394 00:18:18,100 --> 00:18:14,960 that but maybe one or two that would fit 395 00:18:20,110 --> 00:18:18,110 into the conspiracy conman category you 396 00:18:24,010 --> 00:18:20,120 just mentioned one a classic one fell 397 00:18:28,690 --> 00:18:24,020 class you know there was a man who was 398 00:18:31,180 --> 00:18:28,700 constantly conspiring to deceive it 399 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:31,190 seemed to be his avocation when it came 400 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:34,610 to UFOs over and over again and one 401 00:18:39,490 --> 00:18:36,650 would expect better from somebody with 402 00:18:41,620 --> 00:18:39,500 his quite respectable position of a 403 00:18:44,740 --> 00:18:41,630 senior avionics editor for Aviation Week 404 00:18:47,020 --> 00:18:44,750 and space technology which is was a very 405 00:18:51,130 --> 00:18:47,030 good publication you know it's not an 406 00:18:54,520 --> 00:18:51,140 amateur magazine or zine as they call it 407 00:18:56,740 --> 00:18:54,530 it's a quite respected publication we 408 00:18:59,049 --> 00:18:56,750 know that pill can do better all right 409 00:19:01,600 --> 00:18:59,059 so the thing here is you're saying that 410 00:19:04,570 --> 00:19:01,610 Phil did this deliberately not because 411 00:19:06,910 --> 00:19:04,580 well he just didn't believe in UFOs it 412 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:06,920 was he was doing this deliberately to 413 00:19:12,010 --> 00:19:09,410 what end was he working for somebody 414 00:19:14,770 --> 00:19:12,020 that's a question I haven't been able to 415 00:19:17,590 --> 00:19:14,780 answer specifically I I think he was 416 00:19:20,020 --> 00:19:17,600 working for somebody but I don't know 417 00:19:22,810 --> 00:19:20,030 who it could have been mj-12 for all I 418 00:19:26,350 --> 00:19:22,820 know but it's hard to imagine somebody 419 00:19:29,860 --> 00:19:26,360 being as devoted to conspiring if you 420 00:19:32,740 --> 00:19:29,870 will as Phil was was not at being for 421 00:19:37,270 --> 00:19:32,750 somebody some agency call it what you 422 00:19:39,490 --> 00:19:37,280 will remember he was in Washington DC he 423 00:19:41,470 --> 00:19:39,500 didn't have to go far to find agencies 424 00:19:45,310 --> 00:19:41,480 or they didn't have to go far to find 425 00:19:48,280 --> 00:19:45,320 him and so one can come up with all 426 00:19:50,350 --> 00:19:48,290 kinds of explanations and he was always 427 00:19:52,110 --> 00:19:50,360 challenging people to find a paycheck 428 00:19:56,049 --> 00:19:52,120 with his name on it from some 429 00:19:58,360 --> 00:19:56,059 three-letter agency but certainly the 430 00:20:01,530 --> 00:19:58,370 government has had people remember the 431 00:20:05,169 --> 00:20:01,540 church committee hearings about all the 432 00:20:07,660 --> 00:20:05,179 newsmen who worked with the CIA hundreds 433 00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:07,670 of them some of them with their bosses 434 00:20:13,360 --> 00:20:10,010 knowing and some what their bosses not 435 00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:13,370 knowing and not always did money change 436 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:16,730 hands buy checks in other words you 437 00:20:23,529 --> 00:20:18,410 didn't fill out a 438 00:20:25,630 --> 00:20:23,539 - 14 or whatever the the form is so it 439 00:20:28,510 --> 00:20:25,640 wouldn't surprise me of filled covered 440 00:20:31,510 --> 00:20:28,520 his tracks very well I would expect them 441 00:20:33,610 --> 00:20:31,520 to so it wouldn't be for example getting 442 00:20:37,690 --> 00:20:33,620 a check but somebody could be handing 443 00:20:41,500 --> 00:20:37,700 him cash or just throwing him money and 444 00:20:43,299 --> 00:20:41,510 say through a spouse or or a child or 445 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:43,309 someone receives a paycheck and it seems 446 00:20:50,020 --> 00:20:46,010 to come from a routine place but it's 447 00:20:51,700 --> 00:20:50,030 really from them well I wasn't married 448 00:20:55,330 --> 00:20:51,710 until he was sixty and they only got 449 00:20:56,710 --> 00:20:55,340 married then to avoid debating me we 450 00:20:59,470 --> 00:20:56,720 were supposed to debate and that's when 451 00:21:01,210 --> 00:20:59,480 he got married you guys tell me the 452 00:21:04,299 --> 00:21:01,220 story oh wait a minute wait a minute - 453 00:21:06,010 --> 00:21:04,309 stop right here hold your horses we have 454 00:21:09,270 --> 00:21:06,020 about a minute left for this segment but 455 00:21:12,399 --> 00:21:09,280 I'm interested okay but the timing seems 456 00:21:18,520 --> 00:21:12,409 peculiar I assume he didn't just order a 457 00:21:20,110 --> 00:21:18,530 Russian bride that week I understand 458 00:21:26,890 --> 00:21:20,120 they're actually a little bit more 459 00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:26,900 expensive she's a real person but she 460 00:21:32,409 --> 00:21:30,530 brought her son over you know I'll call 461 00:21:35,649 --> 00:21:32,419 it a marriage of convenience if you want 462 00:21:38,830 --> 00:21:35,659 that's that that's okay I'm not making a 463 00:21:41,350 --> 00:21:38,840 plot lines there all I'm saying is bill 464 00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:41,360 was pretty Footloose and fancy-free and 465 00:21:46,450 --> 00:21:44,090 traveled the world which makes him an 466 00:21:49,870 --> 00:21:46,460 ideal person for collecting information 467 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:49,880 and for dissing forming as well he could 468 00:21:54,820 --> 00:21:52,010 go to legitimate scientific or 469 00:21:56,190 --> 00:21:54,830 engineering conferences as a reporter 470 00:21:59,919 --> 00:21:56,200 for Aviation Week and space technology 471 00:22:02,470 --> 00:21:59,929 in many countries in which he did and he 472 00:22:04,090 --> 00:22:02,480 could report back to somebody on what 473 00:22:07,450 --> 00:22:04,100 Americans were saying that they 474 00:22:08,919 --> 00:22:07,460 shouldn't be saying and what Russians 475 00:22:11,950 --> 00:22:08,929 were saying that we would like to know 476 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:11,960 about it I should point out back in the 477 00:22:16,870 --> 00:22:14,210 early 60s I had a contract with foreign 478 00:22:19,870 --> 00:22:16,880 technology division of the Air Force and 479 00:22:22,690 --> 00:22:19,880 I was looking at particularly Russian 480 00:22:25,090 --> 00:22:22,700 information about nuclear reactors and 481 00:22:28,210 --> 00:22:25,100 space technology and stuff like that and 482 00:22:29,510 --> 00:22:28,220 I found in the files that Patel Memorial 483 00:22:31,730 --> 00:22:29,520 Institute 484 00:22:34,610 --> 00:22:31,740 which is an outstanding research and 485 00:22:37,010 --> 00:22:34,620 development firm that they had reports 486 00:22:39,650 --> 00:22:37,020 in those laws from Americans who were 487 00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:39,660 traveling and submitted reports on their 488 00:22:43,610 --> 00:22:41,490 activity so I know it was a common 489 00:22:46,700 --> 00:22:43,620 practice back then let's do our break 490 00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:46,710 fact fiction in flying saucers and our 491 00:23:00,800 --> 00:22:49,410 first conspiracy conman with gene and 492 00:23:04,580 --> 00:23:00,810 Chris you're in the para cast thank you 493 00:23:09,170 --> 00:23:04,590 for listening to GCN be sure to visit 494 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Rendlesham UFO incident you're listening 606 00:27:27,570 --> 00:27:18,700 to the podcast the gold standard of a 607 00:27:32,289 --> 00:27:30,249 so Phil quest I was mentioning in 608 00:27:36,279 --> 00:27:32,299 section 1 of this show before you guys 609 00:27:39,820 --> 00:27:36,289 get on Kathleen and Stanton that I met 610 00:27:42,369 --> 00:27:39,830 Phil class a couple of three times over 611 00:27:44,649 --> 00:27:42,379 the years and Kris had an encounter with 612 00:27:48,009 --> 00:27:44,659 him too they talked about but in my 613 00:27:52,450 --> 00:27:48,019 particular case he seemed particularly 614 00:27:56,190 --> 00:27:52,460 at nasty sort is that your feeling well 615 00:27:59,200 --> 00:27:56,200 he could be he certainly could be benign 616 00:28:02,590 --> 00:27:59,210 gentleman when he felt like it but he 617 00:28:04,389 --> 00:28:02,600 also could be quite nasty depending on 618 00:28:07,570 --> 00:28:04,399 his mood so you know I don't know what 619 00:28:09,940 --> 00:28:07,580 served his ends so to speak we're not 620 00:28:12,430 --> 00:28:09,950 looking at just a guy who didn't believe 621 00:28:15,279 --> 00:28:12,440 in UFOs which is fine we're talking 622 00:28:18,519 --> 00:28:15,289 about someone here with some possible 623 00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:18,529 sinister purpose but he's long gone why 624 00:28:22,299 --> 00:28:20,330 do we care about him now what kind of 625 00:28:25,149 --> 00:28:22,309 influence that he had that's lasting 626 00:28:28,180 --> 00:28:25,159 enough to want to bother with him years 627 00:28:31,060 --> 00:28:28,190 after he died well look at the committee 628 00:28:32,979 --> 00:28:31,070 for skeptical investigation CSI which 629 00:28:34,239 --> 00:28:32,989 used to be committee for the scientific 630 00:28:35,609 --> 00:28:34,249 investigation it claims of the 631 00:28:38,139 --> 00:28:35,619 paranormal 632 00:28:40,269 --> 00:28:38,149 those guys are still going on and Phil 633 00:28:43,239 --> 00:28:40,279 was one of the instigators many years 634 00:28:46,629 --> 00:28:43,249 ago so they've been influenced by his 635 00:28:49,769 --> 00:28:46,639 model so to speak also remember his 636 00:28:54,099 --> 00:28:49,779 first book was translated into Russian 637 00:28:56,649 --> 00:28:54,109 which seemed very no it wasn't his first 638 00:28:58,389 --> 00:28:56,659 book it was Donald Mendel's first book 639 00:29:01,649 --> 00:28:58,399 got translated into Russian another 640 00:29:05,889 --> 00:29:01,659 conspirator we'll get to him in a moment 641 00:29:08,830 --> 00:29:05,899 he was as they say the instigator what 642 00:29:10,419 --> 00:29:08,840 about the rest of this group Robert 643 00:29:13,060 --> 00:29:10,429 Shafer and the others who became 644 00:29:16,239 --> 00:29:13,070 involved again do we see anyone there 645 00:29:19,049 --> 00:29:16,249 with a conspiratorial intent or against 646 00:29:22,119 --> 00:29:19,059 just disbelievers there a difference 647 00:29:24,759 --> 00:29:22,129 well the difference being that it's 648 00:29:27,430 --> 00:29:24,769 perfect if I'm not to agree with a 649 00:29:30,430 --> 00:29:27,440 particular point of view it's not so 650 00:29:34,269 --> 00:29:30,440 fine if you have some sinister intent 651 00:29:37,710 --> 00:29:34,279 behind it okay I'm not a psychologist 652 00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:37,720 I'll leave the social sciences to Cathy 653 00:29:41,820 --> 00:29:39,890 I'm old 654 00:29:44,260 --> 00:29:41,830 you know I look at what is and 655 00:29:46,090 --> 00:29:44,270 occasionally we'll get some why somebody 656 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:46,100 did what they did I mean I can 657 00:29:51,490 --> 00:29:48,050 understand Menzel's for example a lot 658 00:29:53,410 --> 00:29:51,500 easier than class because of what I 659 00:29:56,410 --> 00:29:53,420 found out about him but I didn't find 660 00:29:58,770 --> 00:29:56,420 out that kind of stuff about him okay 661 00:30:02,290 --> 00:29:58,780 let's look at dr. Donald H Menzel 662 00:30:05,650 --> 00:30:02,300 Harvard astronomer I know that he also 663 00:30:10,330 --> 00:30:05,660 did some I guess drawings or paintings 664 00:30:13,210 --> 00:30:10,340 of space people because he obviously had 665 00:30:17,110 --> 00:30:13,220 a few of those that he had oh yeah he 666 00:30:18,700 --> 00:30:17,120 was famous he Mendel was an artist among 667 00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:18,710 other things he also wrote science 668 00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:21,170 fiction although he kept his writing of 669 00:30:25,390 --> 00:30:24,050 science fiction away from other stuff he 670 00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:25,400 was afraid the people at Harvard 671 00:30:29,710 --> 00:30:27,170 wouldn't be happy about that so he used 672 00:30:32,070 --> 00:30:29,720 to assume names was even offered an 673 00:30:35,020 --> 00:30:32,080 editorship of a science fiction magazine 674 00:30:37,630 --> 00:30:35,030 much more important for Menzel as far as 675 00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:37,640 I'm concerned is the work he did for the 676 00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:39,770 government but which I didn't know about 677 00:30:45,490 --> 00:30:42,650 the long after men's what was it which 678 00:30:47,770 --> 00:30:45,500 nobody knew about I should say and that 679 00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:47,780 that one really shocked me because the 680 00:30:52,420 --> 00:30:49,610 most one of my most important 681 00:30:55,570 --> 00:30:52,430 contributions to ufology was to find out 682 00:30:57,580 --> 00:30:55,580 that Donald Menzel had a longer 683 00:30:59,440 --> 00:30:57,590 continuous association with the National 684 00:31:03,460 --> 00:30:59,450 Security Agency 685 00:31:06,580 --> 00:31:03,470 you know mr. Snowden's agents anybody 686 00:31:10,420 --> 00:31:06,590 yeah and he said that to Jack Kennedy 687 00:31:13,660 --> 00:31:10,430 they knew each other first name and and 688 00:31:16,630 --> 00:31:13,670 he said to Kennedy when I can tell you 689 00:31:19,660 --> 00:31:16,640 more about the NSA that's an area I may 690 00:31:24,940 --> 00:31:19,670 be able to help you about when we are 691 00:31:27,100 --> 00:31:24,950 properly cleared to each other and it 692 00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:27,110 helped for me he explained a lot of 693 00:31:30,310 --> 00:31:29,690 things about Menzel's he was too smart a 694 00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:30,320 guy 695 00:31:37,090 --> 00:31:34,130 Nestle was not an idiot at all they was 696 00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:37,100 a major world class cryptologist for 697 00:31:44,410 --> 00:31:41,090 example that goes right with the NSA he 698 00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:44,420 was too smart to try to act dumb about 699 00:31:47,980 --> 00:31:45,290 so many things 700 00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:47,990 Cathy noted that particularly in the 701 00:31:52,060 --> 00:31:49,970 that Air Force conversation that he 702 00:31:56,050 --> 00:31:52,070 hadn't 703 00:32:01,180 --> 00:31:56,060 yes I could tell that story it happened 704 00:32:04,030 --> 00:32:01,190 in May 1952 and he arranged a meeting at 705 00:32:07,500 --> 00:32:04,040 the Pentagon there were five military 706 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:07,510 officers and one secretary present and 707 00:32:13,180 --> 00:32:10,730 he walked in he told the group that he'd 708 00:32:16,330 --> 00:32:13,190 solved the Air Force's UFO problem 709 00:32:19,260 --> 00:32:16,340 through a few elementary experiments 710 00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:19,270 using liquids of different densities and 711 00:32:32,050 --> 00:32:21,890 I hope he wasn't raising them at the 712 00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:32,060 time dr. Stephan pasame said well why do 713 00:32:38,410 --> 00:32:34,610 you think that a few elementary simple 714 00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:38,420 experiments prove anything and Menzel 715 00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:41,930 just changed the subject and to two 716 00:32:49,420 --> 00:32:46,490 hoaxes and he told the group that well 717 00:32:52,050 --> 00:32:49,430 you know that most of these UFO reports 718 00:32:56,020 --> 00:32:52,060 are hoaxes anyway and the Air Force 719 00:33:01,240 --> 00:32:56,030 spoke up and said no they're not only 2% 720 00:33:04,390 --> 00:33:01,250 and then Menzel said that he had written 721 00:33:07,060 --> 00:33:04,400 a couple of articles one for time and 722 00:33:09,610 --> 00:33:07,070 one for look and he wanted the Air 723 00:33:13,180 --> 00:33:09,620 Force's support they want he wanted them 724 00:33:14,700 --> 00:33:13,190 to back him up on these articles that 725 00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:14,710 were clearly going to offer 726 00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:18,650 disinformation and general william 727 00:33:25,750 --> 00:33:22,130 garland said no he that he refused to 728 00:33:28,810 --> 00:33:25,760 blindly endorse Menzel's few simple 729 00:33:31,030 --> 00:33:28,820 theories and benzoyl blew his stack over 730 00:33:34,540 --> 00:33:31,040 that before he left the office 731 00:33:37,870 --> 00:33:34,550 he offered to be an unpaid consultant to 732 00:33:39,310 --> 00:33:37,880 Project Blue Book and although his offer 733 00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:39,320 was rejected 734 00:33:47,020 --> 00:33:43,490 initially we find that in the mid-60s 735 00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:47,030 he's working as an unpaid consultant to 736 00:33:52,990 --> 00:33:48,850 Project Blue Book 737 00:33:55,180 --> 00:33:53,000 so is Philip Glass the thing about men's 738 00:33:57,780 --> 00:33:55,190 old is that he carried a lot of weight 739 00:34:00,490 --> 00:33:57,790 in the scientific community at the time 740 00:34:02,529 --> 00:34:00,500 he's the one whose first book was 741 00:34:05,369 --> 00:34:02,539 translated into Russian 742 00:34:07,930 --> 00:34:05,379 which seems very strange for the fifties 743 00:34:09,549 --> 00:34:07,940 I'm wondering if there wasn't some 744 00:34:13,180 --> 00:34:09,559 intervention on the part of some 745 00:34:15,519 --> 00:34:13,190 government person because you want to 746 00:34:17,559 --> 00:34:15,529 send a message there's nothing to UFOs 747 00:34:18,909 --> 00:34:17,569 we don't want those Russians doing 748 00:34:20,970 --> 00:34:18,919 anything about this and we certainly 749 00:34:24,940 --> 00:34:20,980 don't want them to find out what we know 750 00:34:26,740 --> 00:34:24,950 and the kicker is there with as far as 751 00:34:30,430 --> 00:34:26,750 I've been able to tell and correct me if 752 00:34:33,430 --> 00:34:30,440 I'm wrong nobody knew about Menzel's 753 00:34:36,879 --> 00:34:33,440 insider status until I found that long 754 00:34:39,639 --> 00:34:36,889 after he was gone why would you keep it 755 00:34:42,940 --> 00:34:39,649 so close in other words there are two 756 00:34:47,369 --> 00:34:42,950 issues of Sakai and Telescope magazine 757 00:34:51,639 --> 00:34:47,379 an astronomers Bible if you will popular 758 00:34:54,159 --> 00:34:51,649 devoted to men's dedicated to him one on 759 00:34:55,899 --> 00:34:54,169 the occasion of his death and one on the 760 00:34:56,680 --> 00:34:55,909 occasion is a hundredth anniversary of 761 00:34:59,680 --> 00:34:56,690 his birth 762 00:35:01,299 --> 00:34:59,690 neither one said anything at all about 763 00:35:05,410 --> 00:35:01,309 his highly classified work for the 764 00:35:06,940 --> 00:35:05,420 government after the war and people were 765 00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:06,950 shocked I talked to people at Harvard 766 00:35:10,749 --> 00:35:09,410 after I made my my discovery and I had 767 00:35:13,539 --> 00:35:10,759 to get permission from three different 768 00:35:17,799 --> 00:35:13,549 people look at his papers including his 769 00:35:19,390 --> 00:35:17,809 wife and there were people at Harvard 770 00:35:21,490 --> 00:35:19,400 who couldn't believe many people in 771 00:35:24,849 --> 00:35:21,500 ufology couldn't believe that he could 772 00:35:26,970 --> 00:35:24,859 lead a double life so therefore there's 773 00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:26,980 the assumption the lease implicit here 774 00:35:31,829 --> 00:35:30,170 that when he said UFOs were nonsense 775 00:35:35,319 --> 00:35:31,839 they came out with these simplistic 776 00:35:37,839 --> 00:35:35,329 absurd theories he wasn't doing it as a 777 00:35:40,359 --> 00:35:37,849 lark or he was playing games or just 778 00:35:43,420 --> 00:35:40,369 disbelieves it was because he had a 779 00:35:45,700 --> 00:35:43,430 greater purpose there I would say so I 780 00:35:49,180 --> 00:35:45,710 can't see any other reason why a man of 781 00:35:51,519 --> 00:35:49,190 his stature would say some of the dumb 782 00:35:55,480 --> 00:35:51,529 things that he said and make such a 783 00:35:57,640 --> 00:35:55,490 strong effort unless he was part of a 784 00:36:00,099 --> 00:35:57,650 system that said we got to do that we 785 00:36:01,980 --> 00:36:00,109 got to cover this stuff up that's where 786 00:36:06,609 --> 00:36:01,990 majestic 12 comes into the picture 787 00:36:08,710 --> 00:36:06,619 nobody knew about it while he was alive 788 00:36:10,809 --> 00:36:08,720 long after he died and there are so many 789 00:36:13,750 --> 00:36:10,819 people there's a lot of disinformation 790 00:36:15,100 --> 00:36:13,760 out there about majestic 12 I 791 00:36:17,050 --> 00:36:15,110 one again to that and then I was here 792 00:36:21,720 --> 00:36:17,060 because I know this is a highly disputed 793 00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:21,730 issue but Donald Menzel died decades ago 794 00:36:27,340 --> 00:36:24,410 and maybe he had influence in the early 795 00:36:29,590 --> 00:36:27,350 days of UFO research so what I'd like to 796 00:36:33,550 --> 00:36:29,600 leave on the table before we split for a 797 00:36:37,060 --> 00:36:33,560 piece of business and such is this what 798 00:36:40,180 --> 00:36:37,070 is his lasting influence what happened 799 00:36:41,290 --> 00:36:40,190 after he died that makes him even 800 00:36:44,410 --> 00:36:41,300 important anymore 801 00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:44,420 we have Stanton Friedman Kathleen Martin 802 00:36:57,960 --> 00:36:48,850 with Jean and Christian libera cast 803 00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:04,210 thank you for listening to GCN visit GP 804 00:37:11,829 --> 00:37:09,770 and live.com today we also have swag you 805 00:37:14,980 --> 00:37:11,839 know we have all these exclusive power 806 00:37:17,140 --> 00:37:14,990 cast things that you can buy we've got 807 00:37:20,620 --> 00:37:17,150 like I guess 60 or so different items 808 00:37:24,220 --> 00:37:20,630 and entails t-shirts sleeves for 809 00:37:27,670 --> 00:37:24,230 notebook computers iPad cases mouse pads 810 00:37:29,620 --> 00:37:27,680 the para cast 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Donald H 903 00:41:39,980 --> 00:41:37,200 Menzel who made all those fascinating 904 00:41:41,390 --> 00:41:39,990 paintings I saw a few at Jim Mosley's 905 00:41:44,270 --> 00:41:41,400 home he didn't ask for a lot of money 906 00:41:46,250 --> 00:41:44,280 for it so you know that was fascinating 907 00:41:50,240 --> 00:41:46,260 maybe I should look for one at the eBay 908 00:41:53,390 --> 00:41:50,250 but he's long gone and maybe he had some 909 00:41:56,300 --> 00:41:53,400 influence in casting a whole generation 910 00:42:00,470 --> 00:41:56,310 of astronomers right so you're saying 911 00:42:02,690 --> 00:42:00,480 that it's not just that he expressed 912 00:42:04,849 --> 00:42:02,700 this this belief he influenced 913 00:42:08,030 --> 00:42:04,859 astronomers who came after him 914 00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:08,040 to take the same approach is that still 915 00:42:13,220 --> 00:42:11,010 true i I still think there are people in 916 00:42:16,790 --> 00:42:13,230 the in the field of astronomy and 917 00:42:19,550 --> 00:42:16,800 science in general who actually go back 918 00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:19,560 to being influenced by Menzel's original 919 00:42:23,260 --> 00:42:21,450 approach after all he was at Harvard he 920 00:42:27,710 --> 00:42:23,270 was the chairman of the department 921 00:42:29,390 --> 00:42:27,720 eventually and a world-class astronomer 922 00:42:33,349 --> 00:42:29,400 remembered the National Academy of 923 00:42:36,200 --> 00:42:33,359 Sciences and so forth and he spoke out 924 00:42:39,020 --> 00:42:36,210 in a lot of places not just an 925 00:42:41,300 --> 00:42:39,030 occasional talk or there but as you're 926 00:42:44,180 --> 00:42:41,310 her earlier Time magazine and stuff like 927 00:42:47,630 --> 00:42:44,190 that that influences in the the world 928 00:42:51,710 --> 00:42:47,640 they go to the experts and New York 929 00:42:54,109 --> 00:42:51,720 Times kind of thing and I think the fact 930 00:42:57,230 --> 00:42:54,119 that there was so much ridicule involved 931 00:42:59,930 --> 00:42:57,240 I mean men's will did make fun of many 932 00:43:02,120 --> 00:42:59,940 explanations what I have found on 933 00:43:04,940 --> 00:43:02,130 campuses for example is that when I 934 00:43:06,680 --> 00:43:04,950 asked after my lecture how many people 935 00:43:09,080 --> 00:43:06,690 here believe they've seen what I would 936 00:43:10,700 --> 00:43:09,090 consider to be a flying saucer just 937 00:43:12,440 --> 00:43:10,710 raise your hand I just want to point in 938 00:43:14,300 --> 00:43:12,450 count I'm not asking your name stuff 939 00:43:16,520 --> 00:43:14,310 like that and I'll even say that CIA 940 00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:16,530 wasn't allowed in tonight and stuff like 941 00:43:22,220 --> 00:43:20,130 that typically it's 10% and the hands go 942 00:43:23,780 --> 00:43:22,230 up very hesitantly at the beginning and 943 00:43:26,060 --> 00:43:23,790 then gradually as they realize they're 944 00:43:28,790 --> 00:43:26,070 not the only one ten percent of the 945 00:43:32,450 --> 00:43:28,800 audience and then I asked how many of 946 00:43:34,849 --> 00:43:32,460 you reported what you saw 90% of the 947 00:43:36,530 --> 00:43:34,859 hands go down and the biggest reason 948 00:43:36,770 --> 00:43:36,540 when people come to me to tell me their 949 00:43:38,990 --> 00:43:36,780 story 950 00:43:42,740 --> 00:43:39,000 why they didn't report it was they think 951 00:43:45,410 --> 00:43:42,750 I was some kind of a nut and I tried a 952 00:43:48,020 --> 00:43:45,420 little experiment in a class with the 953 00:43:50,570 --> 00:43:48,030 professor before my evening lecture but 954 00:43:52,820 --> 00:43:50,580 I said let's try something so we had the 955 00:43:55,310 --> 00:43:52,830 students respond to a couple of 956 00:43:57,590 --> 00:43:55,320 questions with their eyes closed so they 957 00:44:00,200 --> 00:43:57,600 weren't influenced by the other students 958 00:44:02,330 --> 00:44:00,210 in the class and I only asked two 959 00:44:04,340 --> 00:44:02,340 questions but they may and let the 960 00:44:06,830 --> 00:44:04,350 professor count the votes so I wasn't 961 00:44:10,700 --> 00:44:06,840 biasing anything how many of you think 962 00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:10,710 most people don't believe in UFOs 80% as 963 00:44:15,140 --> 00:44:12,810 it turns out we didn't announce that 964 00:44:18,110 --> 00:44:15,150 then and then I asked how many of you do 965 00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:18,120 believe in UFOs and let me kind of 966 00:44:24,740 --> 00:44:21,330 devotes 80% did believe but they thought 967 00:44:27,200 --> 00:44:24,750 of 80% thought other people didn't 968 00:44:29,060 --> 00:44:27,210 police they wouldn't express their 969 00:44:31,040 --> 00:44:29,070 positive beliefs because they believed 970 00:44:34,340 --> 00:44:31,050 most other people would think they were 971 00:44:36,230 --> 00:44:34,350 kind of crazy is that it yeah that's a 972 00:44:40,790 --> 00:44:36,240 very good way to put it and I found that 973 00:44:42,680 --> 00:44:40,800 in many places and you know that that's 974 00:44:46,100 --> 00:44:42,690 aside from the national security 975 00:44:47,660 --> 00:44:46,110 considerations you know asking people 976 00:44:49,640 --> 00:44:47,670 did they report it when they were in the 977 00:44:50,990 --> 00:44:49,650 military and they can't talk about it 978 00:44:53,300 --> 00:44:51,000 and stuff like kind of get a lot of good 979 00:44:56,990 --> 00:44:53,310 stories that way but again we're tracing 980 00:44:58,730 --> 00:44:57,000 this back to people like Menzel had that 981 00:45:01,700 --> 00:44:58,740 lasting influence on the scientific 982 00:45:04,250 --> 00:45:01,710 community that you know 4050 years after 983 00:45:09,020 --> 00:45:04,260 he died people are still looking into 984 00:45:10,550 --> 00:45:09,030 his approach didn't Einstein so I just 985 00:45:12,950 --> 00:45:10,560 ran across an article today talk about 986 00:45:16,910 --> 00:45:12,960 Einstein well Einstein is not Donald 987 00:45:18,980 --> 00:45:16,920 Menzel okay no but I'm saying wasn't 988 00:45:20,360 --> 00:45:18,990 asked hey that's a good question I don't 989 00:45:24,560 --> 00:45:20,370 know if Einstein was ever asked about 990 00:45:27,980 --> 00:45:24,570 flying saucers I think that we have to 991 00:45:31,880 --> 00:45:27,990 not think of Donald Menzel as one man 992 00:45:35,720 --> 00:45:31,890 acting independently but as one arm of a 993 00:45:40,820 --> 00:45:35,730 vast conspiracy and that that conspiracy 994 00:45:46,300 --> 00:45:40,830 had the ambition and the motive to deny 995 00:45:50,540 --> 00:45:46,310 the existence of UFOs to cover it up to 996 00:45:52,210 --> 00:45:50,550 discourage scientists from ever having 997 00:45:56,870 --> 00:45:52,220 an interest in the scientific 998 00:46:02,240 --> 00:45:56,880 investigation of this and to perpetrate 999 00:46:04,910 --> 00:46:02,250 the myth even up to today that this is 1000 00:46:08,630 --> 00:46:04,920 nonsense that anyone who has an interest 1001 00:46:11,990 --> 00:46:08,640 in this topic is a kook that it cannot 1002 00:46:15,820 --> 00:46:12,000 be studied scientifically there is so 1003 00:46:20,360 --> 00:46:15,830 much and fact fiction and flying saucers 1004 00:46:24,490 --> 00:46:20,370 has the documented evidence that links 1005 00:46:28,370 --> 00:46:24,500 these individuals together and shows 1006 00:46:30,890 --> 00:46:28,380 their conspiracy it's very clear when 1007 00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:30,900 you read the book so I guess we have the 1008 00:46:39,170 --> 00:46:35,610 third leg of this strange chair dr. 1009 00:46:42,110 --> 00:46:39,180 Edward Condon he was responsible for 1010 00:46:44,450 --> 00:46:42,120 heading up the group that did the Condon 1011 00:46:46,970 --> 00:46:44,460 report which of course is regarded by 1012 00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:46,980 many as a whitewash that this was a 1013 00:46:54,410 --> 00:46:51,330 whitewash and therefore in looking over 1014 00:46:57,740 --> 00:46:54,420 his papers and discovering things about 1015 00:46:59,800 --> 00:46:57,750 him and will go into his case history do 1016 00:47:03,440 --> 00:46:59,810 you think then that the deck was stacked 1017 00:47:06,320 --> 00:47:03,450 all along he went to it he took on the 1018 00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:06,330 assignment knowing that was his intent 1019 00:47:11,180 --> 00:47:08,490 to just make it look as if there's 1020 00:47:14,780 --> 00:47:11,190 nothing to it it certainly seems that 1021 00:47:20,620 --> 00:47:14,790 way and remember he wasn't just a 1022 00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:20,630 professor at a university but he was a 1023 00:47:26,780 --> 00:47:24,170 accepted admired of whatever the word is 1024 00:47:30,320 --> 00:47:26,790 became a member of the National Academy 1025 00:47:33,710 --> 00:47:30,330 of Sciences way back and early days 1026 00:47:34,970 --> 00:47:33,720 pretty young for a scientist and he had 1027 00:47:38,180 --> 00:47:34,980 been president of the American Physical 1028 00:47:39,740 --> 00:47:38,190 Society president of the American 1029 00:47:43,990 --> 00:47:39,750 Association for the Advancement of 1030 00:47:47,450 --> 00:47:44,000 science this is a man with stature and 1031 00:47:50,810 --> 00:47:47,460 you'll notice that the Condon report has 1032 00:47:52,880 --> 00:47:50,820 an approval one long article right at 1033 00:47:54,860 --> 00:47:52,890 the beginning and they looked at dr. 1034 00:47:58,190 --> 00:47:54,870 Condon's work they didn't track any of 1035 00:47:59,780 --> 00:47:58,200 his cases you understand he didn't do 1036 00:48:04,320 --> 00:47:59,790 anything case tracking either for that 1037 00:48:08,250 --> 00:48:04,330 matter and they came up you know 1038 00:48:10,230 --> 00:48:08,260 three cheers for ED and that's where the 1039 00:48:12,210 --> 00:48:10,240 influence comes in when you look at the 1040 00:48:15,120 --> 00:48:12,220 SETI community which is mostly 1041 00:48:18,440 --> 00:48:15,130 astronomers and scientists they're 1042 00:48:21,740 --> 00:48:18,450 influenced by things like that 1043 00:48:25,470 --> 00:48:21,750 science doesn't exist in a vacuum 1044 00:48:29,580 --> 00:48:25,480 there's a big fuss has been about string 1045 00:48:34,350 --> 00:48:29,590 theory and when science takes one 1046 00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:34,360 attitude it discourages and contrary 1047 00:48:39,030 --> 00:48:37,090 attitude you don't want to fight system 1048 00:48:40,860 --> 00:48:39,040 don't tell anybody I'm interested Kathy 1049 00:48:44,940 --> 00:48:40,870 you've heard this from professors as I 1050 00:48:46,500 --> 00:48:44,950 know I have yes you know don't tell 1051 00:48:48,840 --> 00:48:46,510 anybody I'm interested because I might 1052 00:48:52,980 --> 00:48:48,850 lose tenure might lose research grants 1053 00:48:57,120 --> 00:48:52,990 so the nasty noisy negativism is 1054 00:48:59,220 --> 00:48:57,130 pervasive and influential it isn't just 1055 00:49:01,260 --> 00:48:59,230 a question of somebody expressing an 1056 00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:01,270 opinion oh well what effect would he 1057 00:49:08,610 --> 00:49:04,810 have well these are guys whose effects 1058 00:49:10,680 --> 00:49:08,620 were far-reaching and Condon had a 1059 00:49:11,970 --> 00:49:10,690 checkered history about security he 1060 00:49:14,820 --> 00:49:11,980 didn't believe the government should be 1061 00:49:20,130 --> 00:49:14,830 involved in classifying certain things 1062 00:49:24,720 --> 00:49:20,140 and so forth but he did science a great 1063 00:49:27,320 --> 00:49:24,730 disservice with this study and one of 1064 00:49:30,840 --> 00:49:27,330 the points we make in the book is how 1065 00:49:32,820 --> 00:49:30,850 Condon and men's will attack probably 1066 00:49:35,390 --> 00:49:32,830 the best scientists there was on the 1067 00:49:38,880 --> 00:49:35,400 subject of UFOs dr. James Dean MacDonald 1068 00:49:42,300 --> 00:49:38,890 and attacks on one serve as an example 1069 00:49:43,620 --> 00:49:42,310 for the others in other words this is 1070 00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:43,630 what's going to happen to you if you 1071 00:49:52,380 --> 00:49:48,370 speak out Pro UFO you'll be pillaged the 1072 00:49:57,360 --> 00:49:52,390 wake MacDonald was and it was and by all 1073 00:49:59,790 --> 00:49:57,370 of those class Mendel and Condon let me 1074 00:50:01,680 --> 00:49:59,800 ask you here because obviously we can't 1075 00:50:04,170 --> 00:50:01,690 dwell the entire episode just these 1076 00:50:06,750 --> 00:50:04,180 three people do you feel that they were 1077 00:50:09,330 --> 00:50:06,760 working together at all or just three 1078 00:50:13,560 --> 00:50:09,340 separate individuals being directed to 1079 00:50:15,270 --> 00:50:13,570 do their thing Kathy found a lot of 1080 00:50:16,790 --> 00:50:15,280 connections between them wouldn't you 1081 00:50:19,850 --> 00:50:16,800 say I 1082 00:50:21,640 --> 00:50:19,860 they were working together I had I went 1083 00:50:25,750 --> 00:50:21,650 to visit the American Philosophical 1084 00:50:29,750 --> 00:50:25,760 Society several times in Philadelphia I 1085 00:50:32,000 --> 00:50:29,760 read Condon's files there I read 1086 00:50:34,700 --> 00:50:32,010 Menzel's correspondence files and 1087 00:50:37,790 --> 00:50:34,710 classes correspondence files Menzel and 1088 00:50:40,250 --> 00:50:37,800 class had a close relationship there was 1089 00:50:45,710 --> 00:50:40,260 a lot of correspondence between them and 1090 00:50:48,200 --> 00:50:45,720 in one letter Menzel complained to class 1091 00:50:52,010 --> 00:50:48,210 that he was tired of doing the same old 1092 00:50:57,110 --> 00:50:52,020 thing and he was happy to have classes 1093 00:50:59,390 --> 00:50:57,120 assistance in debunking the you 1094 00:51:02,900 --> 00:50:59,400 proponents of the scientific study of 1095 00:51:05,960 --> 00:51:02,910 UFOs they did this together they worked 1096 00:51:08,090 --> 00:51:05,970 on a committee class was the nasty guy 1097 00:51:11,620 --> 00:51:08,100 he was the one who is writing the 1098 00:51:15,620 --> 00:51:11,630 proposals and there was a committee of 1099 00:51:18,110 --> 00:51:15,630 various men who were involved in this 1100 00:51:21,860 --> 00:51:18,120 they were in the Air Force there were 1101 00:51:24,290 --> 00:51:21,870 scientists Condon was in this menzel in 1102 00:51:27,170 --> 00:51:24,300 Condon were even fishing buddies a lot 1103 00:51:30,890 --> 00:51:27,180 of people don't know that will continue 1104 00:51:33,200 --> 00:51:30,900 to go fishing for UFO conspiracy con men 1105 00:51:35,660 --> 00:51:33,210 and more whoo-whoo Stan Friedman 1106 00:51:44,160 --> 00:51:35,670 Kathleen Martin and Gina and Chris 1107 00:51:52,200 --> 00:51:48,570 [Music] 1108 00:51:57,319 --> 00:51:52,210 thank you for listening to GCS 1109 00:52:01,529 --> 00:51:59,789 attack of the rock ODEs has been 1110 00:52:03,450 --> 00:52:01,539 well-received by critics and readers 1111 00:52:06,329 --> 00:52:03,460 alike it's a thrill a minute story 1112 00:52:08,640 --> 00:52:06,339 you'll never forget a former US military 1113 00:52:10,920 --> 00:52:08,650 intelligence officer is haunted by 1114 00:52:13,559 --> 00:52:10,930 intense dreams about a beautiful woman 1115 00:52:16,319 --> 00:52:13,569 pleading for his help after a terrible 1116 00:52:18,450 --> 00:52:16,329 battle in outer space but the dreams 1117 00:52:20,430 --> 00:52:18,460 turn out to be true and thrust him into 1118 00:52:23,130 --> 00:52:20,440 a telepathic love affair with a woman 1119 00:52:25,470 --> 00:52:23,140 whose faraway planet is intent on 1120 00:52:28,289 --> 00:52:25,480 destroying the earth and now the 1121 00:52:30,750 --> 00:52:28,299 gripping tale continues in but coming of 1122 00:52:33,390 --> 00:52:30,760 the protectors it's the second book of 1123 00:52:35,549 --> 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the ad free 1165 00:54:44,440 --> 00:54:40,460 version of this show the exclusive after 1166 00:54:47,290 --> 00:54:44,450 the para cast podcast and lots more 1167 00:54:48,790 --> 00:54:47,300 stuff for low subscription rate plus dot 1168 00:54:52,000 --> 00:54:48,800 for para cast com 1169 00:54:57,760 --> 00:54:52,010 so we're talking about this trifecta of 1170 00:54:59,290 --> 00:54:57,770 skeptics here class men's Oh Condon yeah 1171 00:55:03,090 --> 00:54:59,300 Kathleen you mentioned finding 1172 00:55:06,630 --> 00:55:03,100 correspondence between Menzel and class 1173 00:55:09,820 --> 00:55:06,640 with men's Alaskan class for help in 1174 00:55:13,180 --> 00:55:09,830 debunking any attempts really by society 1175 00:55:15,130 --> 00:55:13,190 the scientific community to to be 1176 00:55:17,590 --> 00:55:15,140 positive proponents of scientific study 1177 00:55:19,690 --> 00:55:17,600 of UFOs can you give us a time frame on 1178 00:55:22,420 --> 00:55:19,700 this correspondence are we back in the 1179 00:55:25,540 --> 00:55:22,430 fifties early sixties when when was this 1180 00:55:31,270 --> 00:55:25,550 we're talking about essentially the mid 1181 00:55:34,420 --> 00:55:31,280 sixties and up to the late sixties we're 1182 00:55:38,370 --> 00:55:34,430 talking about the time when the 1183 00:55:41,680 --> 00:55:38,380 scientific study of UFOs was going on 1184 00:55:43,720 --> 00:55:41,690 Hector quintanilla was also part of this 1185 00:55:47,080 --> 00:55:43,730 the the director of Project Blue Book 1186 00:55:50,500 --> 00:55:47,090 they had a close relationship with all 1187 00:55:54,270 --> 00:55:50,510 of these men as well I even found 1188 00:55:57,430 --> 00:55:54,280 evidence that philip glass was providing 1189 00:55:59,920 --> 00:55:57,440 information to contain eeeh about some 1190 00:56:03,000 --> 00:55:59,930 of the kookiest stories that he could 1191 00:56:06,940 --> 00:56:03,010 find that contain eeeh in his biography 1192 00:56:09,790 --> 00:56:06,950 autobiography wrote turned out to be 1193 00:56:13,030 --> 00:56:09,800 beauties and that he considered class an 1194 00:56:15,310 --> 00:56:13,040 excellent investigator what he was doing 1195 00:56:18,880 --> 00:56:15,320 is turning those kooky store 1196 00:56:21,640 --> 00:56:18,890 raise over to Edward Condon and those 1197 00:56:24,960 --> 00:56:21,650 were the stories that Condon was going 1198 00:56:27,640 --> 00:56:24,970 around speaking about that was drawing 1199 00:56:31,990 --> 00:56:27,650 uproarious laughter from the public 1200 00:56:35,680 --> 00:56:32,000 whenever he would lecture on the 1201 00:56:38,320 --> 00:56:35,690 scientific study of UFOs because it was 1202 00:56:40,990 --> 00:56:38,330 apparent that he did not believe that 1203 00:56:43,360 --> 00:56:41,000 any of it deserved scientific 1204 00:56:48,310 --> 00:56:43,370 investigation now the key I want asked 1205 00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:48,320 here is even if they were also directed 1206 00:56:52,960 --> 00:56:51,530 by the powers that be to do this is 1207 00:56:55,990 --> 00:56:52,970 there any indication that they 1208 00:56:59,890 --> 00:56:56,000 personally held any different views 1209 00:57:02,040 --> 00:56:59,900 other than disbelief in UFOs I could not 1210 00:57:05,200 --> 00:57:02,050 find that evidence 1211 00:57:07,720 --> 00:57:05,210 remember the popular view among 1212 00:57:11,470 --> 00:57:07,730 respectable people was there is no such 1213 00:57:14,170 --> 00:57:11,480 animal sqs okay but what about today 1214 00:57:16,300 --> 00:57:14,180 we're talking again about people who are 1215 00:57:21,550 --> 00:57:16,310 no longer with us who did much of their 1216 00:57:25,750 --> 00:57:21,560 work years ago in 2016 who are their 1217 00:57:28,360 --> 00:57:25,760 successors I think that the tone of the 1218 00:57:30,850 --> 00:57:28,370 general community attitude has changed 1219 00:57:33,430 --> 00:57:30,860 I think the Kepler satellite for example 1220 00:57:35,650 --> 00:57:33,440 has made an enormous impact because 1221 00:57:37,630 --> 00:57:35,660 wasn't too many years ago people were 1222 00:57:39,970 --> 00:57:37,640 saying you know there's nobody out there 1223 00:57:42,370 --> 00:57:39,980 very very few places out there where 1224 00:57:44,590 --> 00:57:42,380 there could be life and there'd be so 1225 00:57:47,620 --> 00:57:44,600 far away they could never get here and 1226 00:57:49,810 --> 00:57:47,630 now with Kepler I mean it's 1227 00:57:53,380 --> 00:57:49,820 extraordinary do you realize that on the 1228 00:57:57,760 --> 00:57:53,390 average now it is considered that a star 1229 00:58:01,570 --> 00:57:57,770 the stars have one planet each some as 1230 00:58:03,550 --> 00:58:01,580 many as 10 some maybe zero but it wasn't 1231 00:58:05,890 --> 00:58:03,560 too many years ago where people will 1232 00:58:08,590 --> 00:58:05,900 Frank Drake made a big pronouncement 1233 00:58:12,400 --> 00:58:08,600 that there might be as many as 8,000 1234 00:58:14,650 --> 00:58:12,410 places in the galaxy galaxies that 1235 00:58:17,380 --> 00:58:14,660 should send signals and we should be 1236 00:58:21,220 --> 00:58:17,390 listening and a better number today 1237 00:58:22,540 --> 00:58:21,230 would probably be a billion in other 1238 00:58:24,730 --> 00:58:22,550 words just within a hundred light-years 1239 00:58:28,610 --> 00:58:24,740 of here which is just down the street 1240 00:58:31,160 --> 00:58:28,620 local neighborhood a few little there 1241 00:58:34,190 --> 00:58:31,170 about ten thousand stars and therefore 1242 00:58:36,680 --> 00:58:34,200 about ten thousand planets now that 1243 00:58:38,870 --> 00:58:36,690 changes your view of things and another 1244 00:58:41,500 --> 00:58:38,880 part of this is that means there are 1245 00:58:45,140 --> 00:58:41,510 plenty of planets that have other 1246 00:58:47,480 --> 00:58:45,150 planets nearby we're 4.3 light years 1247 00:58:48,890 --> 00:58:47,490 from the next star over but there are 1248 00:58:54,080 --> 00:58:48,900 plenty of planets that have other 1249 00:58:56,630 --> 00:58:54,090 planets within less than one light year 1250 00:58:58,850 --> 00:58:56,640 Zeta 1 and Zeta 2 reticular the two 1251 00:59:01,700 --> 00:58:58,860 stars from the Betty and Barney Hill 1252 00:59:04,040 --> 00:59:01,710 star map are an eighth of the light year 1253 00:59:07,040 --> 00:59:04,050 apart you just brought up the seder 1254 00:59:10,210 --> 00:59:07,050 Reticuli now we're talking about a 1255 00:59:13,100 --> 00:59:10,220 binary star system but do they know yeah 1256 00:59:16,670 --> 00:59:13,110 to remember those are southern sky stars 1257 00:59:21,020 --> 00:59:16,680 right so we don't know what about 1258 00:59:23,180 --> 00:59:21,030 evidence of other planets exoplanets 1259 00:59:26,740 --> 00:59:23,190 that orbit them right now I read about a 1260 00:59:31,100 --> 00:59:26,750 duck don't no debris field dust whatever 1261 00:59:34,910 --> 00:59:31,110 okay to the star map very briefly okay 1262 00:59:38,780 --> 00:59:34,920 this is based on the Barney and Betty 1263 00:59:43,280 --> 00:59:38,790 hill case but we look at that star map 1264 00:59:48,100 --> 00:59:43,290 in relation to what we knew back in the 1265 00:59:51,190 --> 00:59:48,110 1960s if we take that map out in 2016 or 1266 00:59:55,420 --> 00:59:51,200 we assume the assumptions made in 1267 00:59:58,250 --> 00:59:55,430 providing it does anything change at all 1268 01:00:00,860 --> 00:59:58,260 well all the distances are somewhat 1269 01:00:02,780 --> 01:00:00,870 different we didn't have a good method 1270 01:00:06,170 --> 01:00:02,790 of measuring the distance to stars 1271 01:00:07,880 --> 01:00:06,180 because nobody needed it after all 1272 01:00:11,060 --> 01:00:07,890 you're not going anywhere what you need 1273 01:00:13,910 --> 01:00:11,070 is where to aim a telescope that means 1274 01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:13,920 you need to two dimensions and in the 1275 01:00:17,660 --> 01:00:15,690 crosshairs you know is where the star is 1276 01:00:20,330 --> 01:00:17,670 whether it's 20 light-years away or 40 1277 01:00:22,610 --> 01:00:20,340 light-years away doesn't matter but it 1278 01:00:26,140 --> 01:00:22,620 was only when the Hipparcos satellite 1279 01:00:30,650 --> 01:00:26,150 came along the European Space Agency 1280 01:00:33,220 --> 01:00:30,660 interesting not NASA they measured about 1281 01:00:36,140 --> 01:00:33,230 a million different star positions and 1282 01:00:37,910 --> 01:00:36,150 so they changed all the numbers of 1283 01:00:41,650 --> 01:00:37,920 anything you did back then would be 1284 01:00:45,359 --> 01:00:41,660 changed with today's data so 1285 01:00:48,569 --> 01:00:45,369 precision is not what we had back then 1286 01:00:52,690 --> 01:00:48,579 Marjorie did an incredible job 1287 01:00:54,720 --> 01:00:52,700 Marjorie fish and I just read something 1288 01:00:59,289 --> 01:00:54,730 where somebody said well she built one 1289 01:01:03,720 --> 01:00:59,299 she built a model and walked around and 1290 01:01:05,829 --> 01:01:03,730 identified stars she built 23 different 1291 01:01:08,859 --> 01:01:05,839 three-dimensional models of our local 1292 01:01:10,599 --> 01:01:08,869 galactic neighborhood if there was one 1293 01:01:13,990 --> 01:01:10,609 thing she was concerned about it was 1294 01:01:18,430 --> 01:01:14,000 accuracy and in my movie UFOs are real 1295 01:01:20,260 --> 01:01:18,440 you'll see dr. Mitchell who was the head 1296 01:01:23,230 --> 01:01:20,270 of the astronomy department Ohio State 1297 01:01:25,089 --> 01:01:23,240 University who had given permission for 1298 01:01:27,690 --> 01:01:25,099 her to look at the star catalog she 1299 01:01:31,150 --> 01:01:27,700 couldn't take him out from the library 1300 01:01:35,500 --> 01:01:31,160 but he is on record as saying how 1301 01:01:40,150 --> 01:01:35,510 accurate her work was you know for the 1302 01:01:43,690 --> 01:01:40,160 time you do the best you can but it was 1303 01:01:45,339 --> 01:01:43,700 a detailed careful objective effort that 1304 01:01:48,849 --> 01:01:45,349 she made I spent time with her that 1305 01:01:50,799 --> 01:01:48,859 isn't just from a phone call I had 1306 01:01:53,859 --> 01:01:50,809 looked at several of our models I made a 1307 01:01:58,630 --> 01:01:53,869 presentation with her the J Allen Hynek 1308 01:02:01,480 --> 01:01:58,640 at the Adler Planetarium in Chicago dr. 1309 01:02:04,120 --> 01:02:01,490 Saunders Dave Saunders was there who had 1310 01:02:08,230 --> 01:02:04,130 worked under Condon wrote a negative 1311 01:02:12,279 --> 01:02:08,240 Condon report if you will Dave had 1312 01:02:14,529 --> 01:02:12,289 access to computer stuff and he also is 1313 01:02:18,130 --> 01:02:14,539 on record as saying how accurate her 1314 01:02:21,309 --> 01:02:18,140 work was so we're not talking about a 1315 01:02:24,730 --> 01:02:21,319 triple a map you know it six tenths of a 1316 01:02:27,720 --> 01:02:24,740 mile here and a pencil a mile there well 1317 01:02:31,180 --> 01:02:27,730 there was no data with which to do that 1318 01:02:32,980 --> 01:02:31,190 but the map looks surprisingly good and 1319 01:02:36,099 --> 01:02:32,990 it makes a couple of important points 1320 01:02:37,990 --> 01:02:36,109 one of them is here you have two 1321 01:02:41,620 --> 01:02:38,000 sun-like stars that are only an eighth 1322 01:02:44,500 --> 01:02:41,630 of a Lightyear apart one would expect 1323 01:02:47,019 --> 01:02:44,510 two things you could see the other star 1324 01:02:51,039 --> 01:02:47,029 all day long from the planet around the 1325 01:02:55,630 --> 01:02:51,049 other one and you'd be more tempted 1326 01:02:55,870 --> 01:02:55,640 toward interstellar travel because you 1327 01:03:00,069 --> 01:02:55,880 got 1328 01:03:02,440 --> 01:03:00,079 next-door neighbor it isn't that the way 1329 01:03:04,269 --> 01:03:02,450 man is I mean look at the flood of 1330 01:03:07,299 --> 01:03:04,279 people that came to the new world after 1331 01:03:09,999 --> 01:03:07,309 Columbus now the reason I bring this up 1332 01:03:12,609 --> 01:03:10,009 at all is because our friend Kevin 1333 01:03:15,490 --> 01:03:12,619 Randall wrote a piece for his blog a 1334 01:03:18,940 --> 01:03:15,500 different perspective suggesting it was 1335 01:03:20,529 --> 01:03:18,950 time to look this over because he felt 1336 01:03:22,870 --> 01:03:20,539 it was badly out of date there's a lot 1337 01:03:24,249 --> 01:03:22,880 of back and forth discussion and it's 1338 01:03:27,160 --> 01:03:24,259 blog about it and that's why I raised 1339 01:03:29,740 --> 01:03:27,170 the issue whether it's time now to look 1340 01:03:32,680 --> 01:03:29,750 it over on the basis of what we know now 1341 01:03:35,049 --> 01:03:32,690 which you say is more or less being done 1342 01:03:36,430 --> 01:03:35,059 to some degree to see whether any of it 1343 01:03:38,019 --> 01:03:36,440 changes but there's another question I 1344 01:03:40,710 --> 01:03:38,029 have about it which I'll bring up in a 1345 01:03:43,420 --> 01:03:40,720 next segment we've got Kathleen Mardin 1346 01:03:46,180 --> 01:03:43,430 Stanton Friedman fact fiction flying 1347 01:03:51,010 --> 01:03:46,190 saucers Jean and Chris you're in the 1348 01:03:51,020 --> 01:03:56,810 [Music] 1349 01:04:02,400 --> 01:03:59,970 the award-winning graphic converter 10 1350 01:04:05,280 --> 01:04:02,410 the universal genius 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Peric 1461 01:08:24,920 --> 01:08:22,710 ask.com so lookie here about the starmap 1462 01:08:27,559 --> 01:08:24,930 that is another point to mention here 1463 01:08:28,820 --> 01:08:27,569 too this is something that was developed 1464 01:08:33,650 --> 01:08:28,830 back in the 60s 1465 01:08:35,930 --> 01:08:33,660 based on the hill case it's kind of a 1466 01:08:38,660 --> 01:08:35,940 one-off isn't it has there ever been 1467 01:08:40,690 --> 01:08:38,670 another abduction case in which anything 1468 01:08:43,370 --> 01:08:40,700 like this came about where one could 1469 01:08:47,000 --> 01:08:43,380 find the recollections of some kind of 1470 01:08:51,970 --> 01:08:47,010 navigation or a map to try to duplicate 1471 01:08:56,900 --> 01:08:51,980 I don't know of one copy to you I dunno 1472 01:09:00,440 --> 01:08:56,910 to one of them both of them were very 1473 01:09:03,380 --> 01:09:00,450 similar to Betty's map I have not done a 1474 01:09:07,250 --> 01:09:03,390 great deal of research into this the 1475 01:09:11,660 --> 01:09:07,260 other two contacted me one of them had 1476 01:09:14,930 --> 01:09:11,670 worked with Budd Hopkins and sent me the 1477 01:09:17,030 --> 01:09:14,940 map that he had drawn which was a little 1478 01:09:21,290 --> 01:09:17,040 bit different than the map that Betty 1479 01:09:24,970 --> 01:09:21,300 drew but there no one has done the kind 1480 01:09:29,750 --> 01:09:24,980 of extensive analysis as far as I know 1481 01:09:33,050 --> 01:09:29,760 on the star map and actually attempted 1482 01:09:36,050 --> 01:09:33,060 to identify where those stars were 1483 01:09:38,870 --> 01:09:36,060 located at SEP 4 of course years and 1484 01:09:42,410 --> 01:09:38,880 years ago when several different 1485 01:09:46,099 --> 01:09:42,420 individuals did their own study of the 1486 01:09:47,960 --> 01:09:46,109 star map and one person Stan knows more 1487 01:09:51,230 --> 01:09:47,970 about it than I do he's the specialist 1488 01:09:53,150 --> 01:09:51,240 in this but there was one or two people 1489 01:09:58,280 --> 01:09:53,160 who were actually looking at our own 1490 01:10:01,640 --> 01:09:58,290 solar system other explanations given 1491 01:10:03,860 --> 01:10:01,650 our grants of that and I'm still a 1492 01:10:06,080 --> 01:10:03,870 couple of things one that we need to 1493 01:10:08,600 --> 01:10:06,090 take into account here is that when 1494 01:10:11,180 --> 01:10:08,610 Betty drew the map it was after a 1495 01:10:16,690 --> 01:10:11,190 posthypnotic suggestion from dr. 1496 01:10:21,200 --> 01:10:19,339 difficult times 1497 01:10:26,810 --> 01:10:21,210 Cathy what's the word I'm looking for 1498 01:10:29,270 --> 01:10:26,820 here on traumatic experiences yes and he 1499 01:10:31,370 --> 01:10:29,280 you know he didn't look at any other as 1500 01:10:35,780 --> 01:10:31,380 far as I know any other UFO abduction 1501 01:10:37,550 --> 01:10:35,790 cases but the admonition to be accurate 1502 01:10:39,319 --> 01:10:37,560 that you know draw it only if she could 1503 01:10:41,930 --> 01:10:39,329 remember it accurately and stuff like 1504 01:10:44,930 --> 01:10:41,940 that it is very important this wasn't 1505 01:10:47,600 --> 01:10:44,940 casual you know I want to see if you can 1506 01:10:49,700 --> 01:10:47,610 draw that it was very clear instruction 1507 01:10:52,490 --> 01:10:49,710 draw it if you can remember it 1508 01:10:55,010 --> 01:10:52,500 accurately and that was part of all 1509 01:10:57,770 --> 01:10:55,020 these sessions with them with Betty and 1510 01:10:59,390 --> 01:10:57,780 Barney and you know there are people who 1511 01:11:01,310 --> 01:10:59,400 say well there's never been an abduction 1512 01:11:03,830 --> 01:11:01,320 and therefore the whole thing is 1513 01:11:05,689 --> 01:11:03,840 nonsense and that's one way of looking 1514 01:11:08,330 --> 01:11:05,699 at that gets you off the hook you know 1515 01:11:12,979 --> 01:11:08,340 you hadn't do any thinking about it but 1516 01:11:15,050 --> 01:11:12,989 the story makes sense I would love to 1517 01:11:19,660 --> 01:11:15,060 have been a fly on the wall during that 1518 01:11:24,350 --> 01:11:19,670 abduction case and I'm sure Kathy would 1519 01:11:24,919 --> 01:11:24,360 yes absolutely and part about the 1520 01:11:28,640 --> 01:11:24,929 starmap 1521 01:11:32,689 --> 01:11:28,650 that that's important is it puts our 1522 01:11:35,740 --> 01:11:32,699 focus nearby I keep running across 1523 01:11:39,979 --> 01:11:35,750 astronomers saying 1524 01:11:43,430 --> 01:11:39,989 michio kaku my greatly respect well 1525 01:11:45,439 --> 01:11:43,440 probably the nearest places a few 1526 01:11:48,589 --> 01:11:45,449 thousand light-years away and why would 1527 01:11:51,640 --> 01:11:48,599 anybody come here anyway I want to bring 1528 01:11:53,870 --> 01:11:51,650 it back home to the local neighborhood 1529 01:11:55,910 --> 01:11:53,880 the difference of course is how much 1530 01:11:58,370 --> 01:11:55,920 time it takes you to get from one place 1531 01:12:01,729 --> 01:11:58,380 to another it's bad enough that the 1532 01:12:04,220 --> 01:12:01,739 people who say is far away dr. seth 1533 01:12:06,560 --> 01:12:04,230 shostack talks about that hundreds of 1534 01:12:09,410 --> 01:12:06,570 light-years away to the nearest place 1535 01:12:11,689 --> 01:12:09,420 there isn't any basis for that at all 1536 01:12:14,300 --> 01:12:11,699 well you see this is very interesting to 1537 01:12:17,390 --> 01:12:14,310 when you bring that up about getting 1538 01:12:20,120 --> 01:12:17,400 from one place to another obviously some 1539 01:12:22,339 --> 01:12:20,130 scientists are looking into propulsion 1540 01:12:24,950 --> 01:12:22,349 methods that might have some at least 1541 01:12:27,200 --> 01:12:24,960 family relationship to warp drive 1542 01:12:29,990 --> 01:12:27,210 isn't that cool you don't need warp 1543 01:12:33,379 --> 01:12:30,000 drive I mean I want to start with what 1544 01:12:35,450 --> 01:12:33,389 we know we know that by 1545 01:12:38,689 --> 01:12:35,460 almost all the energy in the universe is 1546 01:12:41,209 --> 01:12:38,699 produced by nuclear fusion our star the 1547 01:12:43,330 --> 01:12:41,219 Sun and all the other stars we're 1548 01:12:45,760 --> 01:12:43,340 talking about billions and billions I 1549 01:12:48,410 --> 01:12:45,770 produced their energy by nuclear fusion 1550 01:12:51,950 --> 01:12:48,420 we didn't know there was such a thing 1551 01:12:55,070 --> 01:12:51,960 until 1938 we're late comers on the 1552 01:12:58,010 --> 01:12:55,080 cosmic development scene if you will but 1553 01:13:00,109 --> 01:12:58,020 as soon as you say that everybody that 1554 01:13:02,300 --> 01:13:00,119 is going to find out what their star 1555 01:13:05,870 --> 01:13:02,310 uses to produce its energies and then a 1556 01:13:09,020 --> 01:13:05,880 natural question for any civilization I 1557 01:13:12,100 --> 01:13:09,030 would if you found nuclear fusion 500 1558 01:13:15,200 --> 01:13:12,110 years ago where would we be today 1559 01:13:17,060 --> 01:13:15,210 in other words hydrogen and nuclear 1560 01:13:19,010 --> 01:13:17,070 fusion well the most abundant element in 1561 01:13:20,660 --> 01:13:19,020 the universe is hydrogen the lightest 1562 01:13:23,540 --> 01:13:20,670 element in the universe is hydrogen 1563 01:13:26,510 --> 01:13:23,550 fusion is what goes on everywhere that's 1564 01:13:28,939 --> 01:13:26,520 h-bombs so we don't like the link those 1565 01:13:32,030 --> 01:13:28,949 two I guess but that's what we're 1566 01:13:34,669 --> 01:13:32,040 talking about here and it's important to 1567 01:13:37,939 --> 01:13:34,679 realize if you look at Robert Hastings 1568 01:13:42,080 --> 01:13:37,949 book about nukes and UFOs obviously 1569 01:13:45,709 --> 01:13:42,090 aliens show an interest in nukes nuclear 1570 01:13:48,770 --> 01:13:45,719 facility nuclear warheads on missiles 1571 01:13:52,729 --> 01:13:48,780 they've shut down which is kind of a 1572 01:13:55,669 --> 01:13:52,739 neat trick to say the least so what I'm 1573 01:13:57,740 --> 01:13:55,679 suggesting here is this that any 1574 01:13:59,990 --> 01:13:57,750 advanced civilization coming here would 1575 01:14:03,200 --> 01:14:00,000 very quickly know that we had developed 1576 01:14:05,419 --> 01:14:03,210 nuclear weapons not just because of your 1577 01:14:08,570 --> 01:14:05,429 Oshima's nagasaki but we've exploded two 1578 01:14:10,879 --> 01:14:08,580 thousand more and they leave residue 1579 01:14:13,010 --> 01:14:10,889 when you have a nuclear weapon explodes 1580 01:14:15,260 --> 01:14:13,020 you got radioactivity and you go look 1581 01:14:18,649 --> 01:14:15,270 and you can find it well doesn't that 1582 01:14:20,419 --> 01:14:18,659 tell any visiting alien and holy cow not 1583 01:14:23,689 --> 01:14:20,429 only are these idiots killing each other 1584 01:14:26,240 --> 01:14:23,699 only 50 million in World War two I say 1585 01:14:28,760 --> 01:14:26,250 only I don't mean to belittle the deaths 1586 01:14:31,370 --> 01:14:28,770 of those people but from an alien 1587 01:14:35,629 --> 01:14:31,380 viewpoint what kind of a civilization is 1588 01:14:39,890 --> 01:14:35,639 this and why should they even care what 1589 01:14:41,720 --> 01:14:39,900 we do to take the next step if we have 1590 01:14:43,700 --> 01:14:41,730 discovered fusion then we know how to 1591 01:14:45,979 --> 01:14:43,710 get to the Stars if we want to spend the 1592 01:14:46,700 --> 01:14:45,989 money and that makes us a threat to 1593 01:14:48,800 --> 01:14:46,710 everybody and 1594 01:14:49,880 --> 01:14:48,810 neighborhood that's pretty 1595 01:14:51,530 --> 01:14:49,890 straightforward 1596 01:14:53,360 --> 01:14:51,540 let's look at nuclear fusion as 1597 01:14:56,450 --> 01:14:53,370 propulsion system briefly we have a 1598 01:14:58,820 --> 01:14:56,460 break coming up the resize okay well 1599 01:15:02,060 --> 01:14:58,830 warp drive on to the equation is how do 1600 01:15:04,459 --> 01:15:02,070 we go there so it doesn't take us 5 10 1601 01:15:06,680 --> 01:15:04,469 20 50 years whatever it is even the 1602 01:15:09,080 --> 01:15:06,690 galactic neighborhood it's gonna take us 1603 01:15:11,630 --> 01:15:09,090 a lot of years to get there does nuclear 1604 01:15:14,290 --> 01:15:11,640 fusion show us the way to get there 1605 01:15:16,940 --> 01:15:14,300 faster of course 1606 01:15:19,610 --> 01:15:16,950 nuclear fusion than the Einstein no 1607 01:15:22,430 --> 01:15:19,620 let's not forget about all that today 1608 01:15:25,250 --> 01:15:22,440 that's a new name press oh yes good ol 1609 01:15:28,160 --> 01:15:25,260 ow I think it was a song from Paul Simon 1610 01:15:35,479 --> 01:15:28,170 called you can call me al but that's not 1611 01:15:37,700 --> 01:15:35,489 the same guy here is this I worked on a 1612 01:15:41,750 --> 01:15:37,710 study of nuclear fusion for deep space 1613 01:15:44,810 --> 01:15:41,760 propulsion in 1962 that's a long time 1614 01:15:45,280 --> 01:15:44,820 makes me feel old you think I was old or 1615 01:15:51,020 --> 01:15:45,290 something 1616 01:15:53,590 --> 01:15:51,030 anyway in 1962 and we concluded that if 1617 01:15:56,959 --> 01:15:53,600 you want it to go all it takes is dough 1618 01:15:59,840 --> 01:15:56,969 in other words we can get to the Stars 1619 01:16:03,530 --> 01:15:59,850 remember a fusion rocking can kick out 1620 01:16:05,660 --> 01:16:03,540 particles having 10 million times as 1621 01:16:09,229 --> 01:16:05,670 much energy as they get in a dumb old 1622 01:16:11,660 --> 01:16:09,239 chemical rocket 10 million and what you 1623 01:16:14,180 --> 01:16:11,670 can see it we don't want to use words 1624 01:16:17,330 --> 01:16:14,190 like nuclear apparently our society has 1625 01:16:20,320 --> 01:16:17,340 got kind of a bias against that then let 1626 01:16:24,140 --> 01:16:20,330 me take it by the hand a big bomb in 1627 01:16:26,110 --> 01:16:24,150 1944 released the energy of 10 tons of 1628 01:16:30,500 --> 01:16:26,120 dynamite it was called a blockbuster 1629 01:16:33,440 --> 01:16:30,510 let's turn them we'll have further 1630 01:16:37,040 --> 01:16:33,450 description about these power sources 1631 01:16:40,010 --> 01:16:37,050 power sources and systems with Kathleen 1632 01:16:48,200 --> 01:16:40,020 Stanton Jean and Chris you're in the 1633 01:16:58,450 --> 01:16:52,180 you are listening to GPS 1634 01:17:00,670 --> 01:16:58,460 visit GP and live.com today as neck back 1635 01:17:03,850 --> 01:17:00,680 or shoulder pain got you down go to 1636 01:17:06,070 --> 01:17:03,860 sunshine pillows calm and get soothing 1637 01:17:08,170 --> 01:17:06,080 comfort support contain relief fast 1638 01:17:10,210 --> 01:17:08,180 they're microwavable heat therapy 1639 01:17:12,430 --> 01:17:10,220 pillows and wraps treat neck and 1640 01:17:14,650 --> 01:17:12,440 shoulder pain reduce stress and relax 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hunger to 1730 01:20:43,859 --> 01:20:41,860 share their experiences about the 1731 01:20:46,080 --> 01:20:43,869 paranormal the unexplainable for the 1732 01:20:48,330 --> 01:20:46,090 afterlife and so much more and this is 1733 01:20:50,339 --> 01:20:48,340 the source for them to meet and share 1734 01:20:53,040 --> 01:20:50,349 that common interest Society for free at 1735 01:20:56,129 --> 01:20:53,050 paranormal date calm paranormal date 1736 01:21:02,730 --> 01:20:56,139 calm and use the code George if you 1737 01:21:07,960 --> 01:21:05,650 hello this is rosemary ellen guiley and 1738 01:21:10,620 --> 01:21:07,970 you're listening to the podcast the gold 1739 01:21:27,260 --> 01:21:10,630 standard of paranormal radio 1740 01:21:32,190 --> 01:21:30,480 see Chris is swallowing fusion drive 1741 01:21:34,500 --> 01:21:32,200 right there there he goes 1742 01:21:36,780 --> 01:21:34,510 alright so you talk or hear about we're 1743 01:21:38,280 --> 01:21:36,790 trying to get a perspective of how much 1744 01:21:39,870 --> 01:21:38,290 power we're talking about here and 1745 01:21:43,530 --> 01:21:39,880 you're going back to the original 1746 01:21:45,540 --> 01:21:43,540 nuclear bombs Stanton go ahead yeah the 1747 01:21:49,020 --> 01:21:45,550 big blockbuster released the energy of 1748 01:21:51,060 --> 01:21:49,030 ten tons of dynamite and made a big hole 1749 01:21:53,430 --> 01:21:51,070 in the ground through believe me we 1750 01:21:55,710 --> 01:21:53,440 destroyed after all during the war 1700 1751 01:21:59,580 --> 01:21:55,720 cities most of them by bombing with Park 1752 01:22:03,090 --> 01:21:59,590 Buster's anyway the first atomic bomb in 1753 01:22:06,840 --> 01:22:03,100 1945 fission bomb if you will release 1754 01:22:10,530 --> 01:22:06,850 the energy of about 16,000 tons of 1755 01:22:15,660 --> 01:22:10,540 dynamite that's a big step from 10 to 16 1756 01:22:19,890 --> 01:22:15,670 thousand but that's nothing 1952 our 1757 01:22:25,650 --> 01:22:19,900 first h-bomb fusion device 10 million 1758 01:22:29,970 --> 01:22:25,660 tons of dynamite in one lousy weapon the 1759 01:22:32,010 --> 01:22:29,980 fireball was three miles why but we 1760 01:22:34,620 --> 01:22:32,020 weren't finished we efficient earth wins 1761 01:22:40,290 --> 01:22:34,630 the Russians sent one off a few years 1762 01:22:43,200 --> 01:22:40,300 later 57 million tons of dynamite in one 1763 01:22:46,830 --> 01:22:43,210 stinking weapon now think about that for 1764 01:22:51,810 --> 01:22:46,840 a minute from ten to fifteen thousand to 1765 01:22:54,810 --> 01:22:51,820 ten tons 257 million tons of dynamite in 1766 01:22:56,540 --> 01:22:54,820 one weapon that is a power source 1767 01:22:59,700 --> 01:22:56,550 that'll get you to the stars 1768 01:23:02,430 --> 01:22:59,710 okay how fast does it take you to get 1769 01:23:04,950 --> 01:23:02,440 there okay today we're going to Proxima 1770 01:23:06,930 --> 01:23:04,960 Centauri which is over four light-years 1771 01:23:10,770 --> 01:23:06,940 from us how long does that trip take 1772 01:23:12,630 --> 01:23:10,780 well let's again bring in Einstein here 1773 01:23:14,760 --> 01:23:12,640 a little bit not only equals mc-squared 1774 01:23:16,800 --> 01:23:14,770 which is where the energy comes from 1775 01:23:22,110 --> 01:23:16,810 from the fusion process and that was 1776 01:23:24,570 --> 01:23:22,120 Einstein - but at 1g acceleration which 1777 01:23:26,910 --> 01:23:24,580 we're all standing right now because you 1778 01:23:29,460 --> 01:23:26,920 know if you fall you're falling at 1g so 1779 01:23:32,400 --> 01:23:29,470 to speak you know it takes less than a 1780 01:23:33,480 --> 01:23:32,410 year to get to the speed of light close 1781 01:23:36,510 --> 01:23:33,490 to the speed of light 1782 01:23:40,830 --> 01:23:36,520 let me hedge my words a little bit less 1783 01:23:44,070 --> 01:23:40,840 than a year at 99.99% of the speed Oh 1784 01:23:47,879 --> 01:23:44,080 you can go 37 light-years in less than a 1785 01:23:49,229 --> 01:23:47,889 year pilot time pilot time you know you 1786 01:23:51,030 --> 01:23:49,239 go out come back marry your 1787 01:23:52,770 --> 01:23:51,040 granddaughters best friends okay know 1788 01:23:54,450 --> 01:23:52,780 what that's this tradition to look at it 1789 01:23:57,479 --> 01:23:54,460 so in this case here that's my 1790 01:23:59,640 --> 01:23:57,489 traditional that the latest perfect it's 1791 01:24:01,530 --> 01:23:59,650 something that you know I've read about 1792 01:24:03,750 --> 01:24:01,540 for a number of years set your 1793 01:24:06,209 --> 01:24:03,760 perception of time changes but the 1794 01:24:09,680 --> 01:24:06,219 physical based on everybody else's 1795 01:24:13,050 --> 01:24:09,690 perception of time they leave Earth that 1796 01:24:15,510 --> 01:24:13,060 99% of the speed of light to go for my 1797 01:24:17,399 --> 01:24:15,520 ears so it takes a little bit more than 1798 01:24:22,050 --> 01:24:17,409 that to get there a little over four 1799 01:24:24,750 --> 01:24:22,060 years to get there I'm not talking about 1800 01:24:27,390 --> 01:24:24,760 pilot time I'm talking about the time 1801 01:24:31,410 --> 01:24:27,400 back here at home to them yes I 1802 01:24:33,570 --> 01:24:31,420 understand that point we've managed to 1803 01:24:35,310 --> 01:24:33,580 the pilots if it takes less time but it 1804 01:24:37,740 --> 01:24:35,320 matters to everybody else who sends him 1805 01:24:40,050 --> 01:24:37,750 there we're sending him to Zeta Reticuli 1806 01:24:42,750 --> 01:24:40,060 and it's what you know tens of years 1807 01:24:45,000 --> 01:24:42,760 before they physically get there even if 1808 01:24:46,649 --> 01:24:45,010 they perceive it to be a short amount of 1809 01:24:49,800 --> 01:24:46,659 time or a relatively short amount of 1810 01:24:53,700 --> 01:24:49,810 time I'm trying to say here is we have 1811 01:24:56,280 --> 01:24:53,710 an energy source that if we learn to 1812 01:24:59,520 --> 01:24:56,290 control it besides making bombs on let's 1813 01:25:02,550 --> 01:24:59,530 face we did it with fishing force atomic 1814 01:25:05,070 --> 01:25:02,560 bomb was an explosion okay now we have 1815 01:25:09,330 --> 01:25:05,080 aircraft carriers that use fish and 1816 01:25:12,959 --> 01:25:09,340 nuclear reactors that can operate for 18 1817 01:25:14,820 --> 01:25:12,969 years without refueling that's putting 1818 01:25:18,390 --> 01:25:14,830 it to practical use we have submarines 1819 01:25:21,540 --> 01:25:18,400 that can astonishingly go around the 1820 01:25:23,879 --> 01:25:21,550 world without coming to the surface 1821 01:25:25,859 --> 01:25:23,889 tried to win that with the diesel engine 1822 01:25:28,770 --> 01:25:25,869 no in the World War through the sub 1823 01:25:31,919 --> 01:25:28,780 state under for a day or so because the 1824 01:25:35,339 --> 01:25:31,929 diesels Navy air lots of it isn't what 1825 01:25:39,089 --> 01:25:35,349 I'm saying is we already know about 1826 01:25:42,270 --> 01:25:39,099 means of producing lots of controllable 1827 01:25:45,270 --> 01:25:42,280 energy now you wouldn't expect us to be 1828 01:25:47,790 --> 01:25:45,280 the most advanced considering you go 1829 01:25:50,189 --> 01:25:47,800 back 120 years the neutron wasn't even 1830 01:25:52,439 --> 01:25:50,199 discovered until 1932 where 1831 01:25:54,130 --> 01:25:52,449 johnny-come-lately 's we cannot assume 1832 01:25:56,950 --> 01:25:54,140 that everybody else's came 1833 01:25:58,420 --> 01:25:56,960 after us and developing new technology 1834 01:26:00,160 --> 01:25:58,430 I'd say quite the reverse 1835 01:26:02,290 --> 01:26:00,170 the planets only been around four 1836 01:26:04,240 --> 01:26:02,300 billion years there's plenty of time for 1837 01:26:07,240 --> 01:26:04,250 somebody to have gotten started well 1838 01:26:10,750 --> 01:26:07,250 before we did and in the obvious place 1839 01:26:14,340 --> 01:26:10,760 of figuring out how it start work I've 1840 01:26:19,540 --> 01:26:14,350 got a quick question here and I'm still 1841 01:26:22,450 --> 01:26:19,550 wondering why an ET civilization here z' 1842 01:26:25,480 --> 01:26:22,460 away would be so concerned about us 1843 01:26:29,350 --> 01:26:25,490 popping off primitive nuclear weapons i 1844 01:26:32,110 --> 01:26:29,360 would they're not i'm saying that you 1845 01:26:34,420 --> 01:26:32,120 extrapolate from that look at the rapid 1846 01:26:38,890 --> 01:26:34,430 rate in which we have developed things 1847 01:26:41,050 --> 01:26:38,900 nuclear so they should know about the 1848 01:26:44,470 --> 01:26:41,060 whole neighborhood that when you get 1849 01:26:46,360 --> 01:26:44,480 rogues being nasty they're a threat to 1850 01:26:49,900 --> 01:26:46,370 the neighborhood so they're looking not 1851 01:26:52,180 --> 01:26:49,910 at us today but us ten twenty fifty 1852 01:26:55,120 --> 01:26:52,190 years from now when we can take that 1853 01:26:57,580 --> 01:26:55,130 technology and go out there i would say 1854 01:27:00,310 --> 01:26:57,590 so wouldn't you we didn't learn anything 1855 01:27:03,250 --> 01:27:00,320 from Pearl Harbor you know that the week 1856 01:27:06,010 --> 01:27:03,260 before Pearl Harbor and crazy story the 1857 01:27:09,880 --> 01:27:06,020 army-navy football game had a picture of 1858 01:27:11,770 --> 01:27:09,890 the USS Arizona huge battleship and 1859 01:27:14,910 --> 01:27:11,780 there was a statement in the text that 1860 01:27:17,680 --> 01:27:14,920 nobody had ever sunk a ship from the sky 1861 01:27:19,800 --> 01:27:17,690 Pearl Harbor was eight days later and 1862 01:27:24,910 --> 01:27:19,810 eleven hundred guys went to their death 1863 01:27:28,030 --> 01:27:24,920 okay but here's the thing if ET is out 1864 01:27:32,260 --> 01:27:28,040 fair seas that those humans with all 1865 01:27:34,810 --> 01:27:32,270 their tribal battles they're in danger 1866 01:27:35,080 --> 01:27:34,820 of becoming a spacefaring power we've 1867 01:27:37,450 --> 01:27:35,090 got 1868 01:27:40,330 --> 01:27:37,460 Elon Musk and he's wants to get to Mars 1869 01:27:43,270 --> 01:27:40,340 in the next five or ten years we'd get 1870 01:27:45,340 --> 01:27:43,280 crews up to 100 people if anyone's gonna 1871 01:27:48,070 --> 01:27:45,350 use cutting-edge technology it's gonna 1872 01:27:51,040 --> 01:27:48,080 be some private entrepreneur who's 1873 01:27:53,560 --> 01:27:51,050 looking for profits now not really 1874 01:27:55,570 --> 01:27:53,570 because the cost to develop some of 1875 01:27:58,810 --> 01:27:55,580 these things like the Manhattan Project 1876 01:28:01,210 --> 01:27:58,820 and stuff is something for governments 1877 01:28:03,010 --> 01:28:01,220 in general I'd say okay but whatever it 1878 01:28:04,870 --> 01:28:03,020 is if we get the gumption to do it 1879 01:28:07,780 --> 01:28:04,880 because obviously we lost that gumption 1880 01:28:10,000 --> 01:28:07,790 but woody T if they felt 1881 01:28:12,940 --> 01:28:10,010 a potential future threat want to come 1882 01:28:15,610 --> 01:28:12,950 down here and send Klaatu to say look 1883 01:28:17,620 --> 01:28:15,620 you earthlings get your acts together or 1884 01:28:20,230 --> 01:28:17,630 we will act accordingly 1885 01:28:22,500 --> 01:28:20,240 or has that happened already and maybe 1886 01:28:24,940 --> 01:28:22,510 that explains why space travel 1887 01:28:28,420 --> 01:28:24,950 preparation is slowed down so much I 1888 01:28:30,460 --> 01:28:28,430 don't know I certainly wouldn't say that 1889 01:28:32,500 --> 01:28:30,470 it's impossible I would not say it's 1890 01:28:35,200 --> 01:28:32,510 impossible that governments haven't been 1891 01:28:36,880 --> 01:28:35,210 talked to by you or anybody else you 1892 01:28:38,380 --> 01:28:36,890 know I think there's been a lot of 1893 01:28:40,570 --> 01:28:38,390 communication that we don't know a darn 1894 01:28:42,250 --> 01:28:40,580 thing about well okay well now maybe 1895 01:28:45,220 --> 01:28:42,260 we're stretching a little bit here I 1896 01:28:48,160 --> 01:28:45,230 mean if we assume any governments of 1897 01:28:49,630 --> 01:28:48,170 Earth know we're being visited must we 1898 01:28:52,660 --> 01:28:49,640 assume they're in touch with those 1899 01:28:55,600 --> 01:28:52,670 visitors I'm not saying we must assume 1900 01:28:58,780 --> 01:28:55,610 I'm saying I've seen so much evidence of 1901 01:29:00,550 --> 01:28:58,790 secrecy on all aspects of this you know 1902 01:29:03,940 --> 01:29:00,560 look at the statement from general 1903 01:29:06,850 --> 01:29:03,950 Bohlander reports of UFOs which could 1904 01:29:10,240 --> 01:29:06,860 affect national security are not part of 1905 01:29:12,070 --> 01:29:10,250 the Bluebook system i spoke with general 1906 01:29:13,660 --> 01:29:12,080 Bolender he was asked by the airforce 1907 01:29:16,240 --> 01:29:13,670 what should we do about Project Blue 1908 01:29:17,920 --> 01:29:16,250 Book because dr. Condon had said we 1909 01:29:19,660 --> 01:29:17,930 should close Project Blue Book is not 1910 01:29:23,710 --> 01:29:19,670 contributing anything science or 1911 01:29:25,510 --> 01:29:23,720 technology and Bolender was asked to do 1912 01:29:27,100 --> 01:29:25,520 this and he wrote a memo which resulted 1913 01:29:29,680 --> 01:29:27,110 in the closure Project Blue Book we 1914 01:29:31,120 --> 01:29:29,690 didn't know about so 10 years later well 1915 01:29:33,760 --> 01:29:31,130 we knew Blue Book was closed we didn't 1916 01:29:36,820 --> 01:29:33,770 know that about this memo I talk to 1917 01:29:38,200 --> 01:29:36,830 Bolin her on the phone I said it seems 1918 01:29:40,660 --> 01:29:38,210 to me you're saying there are two 1919 01:29:42,370 --> 01:29:40,670 separate communication channels for UFO 1920 01:29:44,440 --> 01:29:42,380 reports those which could affect 1921 01:29:46,930 --> 01:29:44,450 national security like the one I'd heard 1922 01:29:48,730 --> 01:29:46,940 a few weeks before about a saucer going 1923 01:29:51,520 --> 01:29:48,740 down the runway at a sac base where 1924 01:29:53,110 --> 01:29:51,530 nuclear weapons were stored or if my 1925 01:29:56,710 --> 01:29:53,120 wife and I are out driving around see 1926 01:29:59,620 --> 01:29:56,720 UFO big deal it was at that time a place 1927 01:30:02,260 --> 01:29:59,630 for us to report and he agreed with me 1928 01:30:06,480 --> 01:30:02,270 two separate channels of communication 1929 01:30:08,760 --> 01:30:06,490 but think of the impact of what he said 1930 01:30:11,650 --> 01:30:08,770 reports which could affect national 1931 01:30:14,110 --> 01:30:11,660 security are not part of the Blue Book 1932 01:30:17,710 --> 01:30:14,120 system now the Air Force has been saying 1933 01:30:19,840 --> 01:30:17,720 for how many years decades that there is 1934 01:30:21,850 --> 01:30:19,850 no national security concern and Blue 1935 01:30:24,140 --> 01:30:21,860 Book was the only thing that was 1936 01:30:26,840 --> 01:30:24,150 it's funny when you talk to the Office 1937 01:30:29,899 --> 01:30:26,850 of Naval Intelligence we don't have 1938 01:30:32,300 --> 01:30:29,909 anything about UFOs they say I don't 1939 01:30:34,160 --> 01:30:32,310 believe in for a minute I hope you 1940 01:30:35,689 --> 01:30:34,170 believe this ladies and gentlemen and 1941 01:30:38,660 --> 01:30:35,699 we'll be back with more with Stanton 1942 01:30:50,450 --> 01:30:38,670 Friedman Kathleen Marden and Jean and 1943 01:30:53,200 --> 01:30:50,460 Chris you're in a para cast thank you 1944 01:30:57,790 --> 01:30:53,210 for listening to GCN 1945 01:31:00,010 --> 01:30:57,800 be sure to visit GCN live.com today we 1946 01:31:03,310 --> 01:31:00,020 also have swag you know we have all 1947 01:31:04,150 --> 01:31:03,320 these exclusive para cast things that 1948 01:31:06,100 --> 01:31:04,160 you can buy 1949 01:31:08,920 --> 01:31:06,110 we've got like I guess 60 or so 1950 01:31:12,490 --> 01:31:08,930 different items and entails t-shirts 1951 01:31:15,820 --> 01:31:12,500 sleeves for notebook computers iPad 1952 01:31:18,160 --> 01:31:15,830 cases mouse pads the para cast jumbo 1953 01:31:19,959 --> 01:31:18,170 tote bag all sorts of t-shirts and 1954 01:31:23,200 --> 01:31:19,969 jackets and stuff like that for men and 1955 01:31:25,479 --> 01:31:23,210 women we have a para cast aluminum water 1956 01:31:28,450 --> 01:31:25,489 bottle all the stuff you go to steward 1957 01:31:31,150 --> 01:31:28,460 onto the para cast comm store doctor 1958 01:31:33,729 --> 01:31:31,160 para cast comm what makes special is 1959 01:31:36,700 --> 01:31:33,739 that the items are the best quality of 1960 01:31:38,410 --> 01:31:36,710 great t-shirts fabrics and they have our 1961 01:31:40,870 --> 01:31:38,420 official logo on them that's what makes 1962 01:31:43,690 --> 01:31:40,880 them special multiple sizes and colors 1963 01:31:46,030 --> 01:31:43,700 we even have stuff for children stuff 1964 01:31:48,760 --> 01:31:46,040 for women's stuff for men we have all 1965 01:31:50,920 --> 01:31:48,770 sorts of sizes like small up to X large 1966 01:31:53,979 --> 01:31:50,930 a lot good stuff that's the swag from 1967 01:31:56,920 --> 01:31:53,989 the para cast to go to steward da ^ cast 1968 01:31:58,660 --> 01:31:56,930 calm stop by and take a shopping tour 1969 01:32:00,910 --> 01:31:58,670 are the answers to your present and 1970 01:32:02,530 --> 01:32:00,920 future hidden in your past akashic 1971 01:32:04,720 --> 01:32:02,540 readings help you learn to unlock the 1972 01:32:07,540 --> 01:32:04,730 answers for love finances weight loss 1973 01:32:09,729 --> 01:32:07,550 self-esteem confusion grief and loss and 1974 01:32:12,010 --> 01:32:09,739 more akashic e-mail readings by dr. 1975 01:32:14,229 --> 01:32:12,020 kelly maroon PhD our specially priced 1976 01:32:16,750 --> 01:32:14,239 right now learn more at dr. Kelly 1977 01:32:20,800 --> 01:32:16,760 Maroons website akashic universal comm 1978 01:32:22,660 --> 01:32:20,810 spelled aka Shi C universal comm change 1979 01:32:24,610 --> 01:32:22,670 your life today become one with your 1980 01:32:26,960 --> 01:32:24,620 true path with intention on purpose 1981 01:32:29,660 --> 01:32:26,970 visit Akashic universal comm 1982 01:32:31,280 --> 01:32:29,670 this is an alert if your business or 1983 01:32:32,900 --> 01:32:31,290 church is building this year you're 1984 01:32:33,980 --> 01:32:32,910 about to pay more than you should 1985 01:32:36,290 --> 01:32:33,990 this could mean thousands of dollars 1986 01:32:38,450 --> 01:32:36,300 more for your office retail space Church 1987 01:32:39,860 --> 01:32:38,460 or warehouse a general steel building 1988 01:32:42,020 --> 01:32:39,870 can save you as much as half the cost 1989 01:32:43,520 --> 01:32:42,030 and time of similar conventional 1990 01:32:46,100 --> 01:32:43,530 construction and we're 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living communities in your area call one 2032 01:34:27,080 --> 01:34:25,260 eight hundred seventy four six one eight 2033 01:34:29,780 --> 01:34:27,090 two that's one eight hundred seven zero 2034 01:34:31,790 --> 01:34:29,790 four six one eight two fully cooks ready 2035 01:34:34,580 --> 01:34:31,800 to eat bacon I'm talking thick meaty 2036 01:34:37,700 --> 01:34:34,590 center-cut presidential bacon savory and 2037 01:34:40,340 --> 01:34:37,710 delicious I buy some I use some I store 2038 01:34:40,640 --> 01:34:40,350 some awesome no refrigeration needed 2039 01:34:42,770 --> 01:34:40,650 with 2040 01:34:45,200 --> 01:34:42,780 ten years shelf life NASA pack 2041 01:34:47,420 --> 01:34:45,210 technology bacon fully cooked fully 2042 01:34:49,600 --> 01:34:47,430 hydrated ready-to-eat right from the 2043 01:34:52,490 --> 01:34:49,610 pack bacon or warm and served 2044 01:34:55,130 --> 01:34:52,500 life-saving ready to eat bacon ten years 2045 01:34:57,380 --> 01:34:55,140 shelf-life bacon ships free at fully 2046 01:35:06,020 --> 01:34:57,390 cooked bacon calm fully cooked bacon 2047 01:35:08,000 --> 01:35:06,030 calm this is Micah hang to the graylien 2048 01:35:10,040 --> 01:35:08,010 report and you're listening to the para 2049 01:35:10,780 --> 01:35:10,050 cast the gold standard of paranormal 2050 01:35:18,560 --> 01:35:10,790 radio 2051 01:35:21,359 --> 01:35:18,570 [Music] 2052 01:35:23,939 --> 01:35:21,369 okay we've got Jean and Chris Kathleen 2053 01:35:27,270 --> 01:35:23,949 and Stanton looking into what the 2054 01:35:33,600 --> 01:35:27,280 governments may know we've had these 2055 01:35:37,470 --> 01:35:33,610 demands for ages on end to reveal the 2056 01:35:38,879 --> 01:35:37,480 truth about UFOs from Donald Kehoe who I 2057 01:35:41,520 --> 01:35:38,889 guess was you know one of the big 2058 01:35:45,510 --> 01:35:41,530 disclosure advocates of the 50s to today 2059 01:35:50,310 --> 01:35:45,520 yeah disclose disclose disclose man 2060 01:35:52,410 --> 01:35:50,320 hasn't done anything yet now well I'm 2061 01:35:56,000 --> 01:35:52,420 not saying Stan Friedman did I said that 2062 01:35:59,069 --> 01:35:56,010 there has been yeah that sort of demand 2063 01:36:02,040 --> 01:35:59,079 all right you've been talking about this 2064 01:36:04,979 --> 01:36:02,050 thing for quite a few years yourself and 2065 01:36:08,040 --> 01:36:04,989 Kathleen certainly has after all this 2066 01:36:10,770 --> 01:36:08,050 time first question do we really know 2067 01:36:13,260 --> 01:36:10,780 that the government knows much more than 2068 01:36:15,870 --> 01:36:13,270 we do I mean they may know things that 2069 01:36:18,629 --> 01:36:15,880 are related to classified military 2070 01:36:21,720 --> 01:36:18,639 hardware and such but do they know that 2071 01:36:24,390 --> 01:36:21,730 much more about UFOs well I would 2072 01:36:27,569 --> 01:36:24,400 certainly think so for a couple of 2073 01:36:29,970 --> 01:36:27,579 reasons one I'd look at the NSA which 2074 01:36:32,609 --> 01:36:29,980 because of a legal action managed we 2075 01:36:36,000 --> 01:36:32,619 managed to get 156 pages of top-secret 2076 01:36:38,280 --> 01:36:36,010 umbra NSA UFO documents there was a 2077 01:36:41,060 --> 01:36:38,290 little problem you could read one 2078 01:36:43,620 --> 01:36:41,070 sentence per page there's a bunch of CIA 2079 01:36:47,149 --> 01:36:43,630 top-secret documents are all blacked out 2080 01:36:50,250 --> 01:36:47,159 so there's no question we know more than 2081 01:36:52,799 --> 01:36:50,260 not we the government so somebody in the 2082 01:36:54,479 --> 01:36:52,809 government and I say government secrets 2083 01:36:57,799 --> 01:36:54,489 aren't kept by telling everybody and 2084 01:37:00,149 --> 01:36:57,809 hoping nobody talks right but because 2085 01:37:02,220 --> 01:37:00,159 something is blacked out doesn't mean 2086 01:37:05,549 --> 01:37:02,230 it's the secret of the UFOs it may be 2087 01:37:08,520 --> 01:37:05,559 again about personnel military hardware 2088 01:37:11,430 --> 01:37:08,530 things that you would expect that they 2089 01:37:14,459 --> 01:37:11,440 would want to see admittedly UFO 2090 01:37:17,220 --> 01:37:14,469 documents the NSA 2091 01:37:20,160 --> 01:37:17,230 yes Stanton I understand that that 2092 01:37:21,870 --> 01:37:20,170 doesn't tell us what's being emitted it 2093 01:37:23,910 --> 01:37:21,880 may be as I said things that you'd 2094 01:37:27,270 --> 01:37:23,920 expect them to omit things about 2095 01:37:28,919 --> 01:37:27,280 military hardware personnel things that 2096 01:37:30,359 --> 01:37:28,929 we don't want foreign powers to know 2097 01:37:31,000 --> 01:37:30,369 about it doesn't mean it's guilty 2098 01:37:34,540 --> 01:37:31,010 knowledge of 2099 01:37:36,340 --> 01:37:34,550 ufo's does it no not necessarily on the 2100 01:37:39,070 --> 01:37:36,350 other hand who's got all the good 2101 01:37:41,320 --> 01:37:39,080 equipment for monitoring UFOs the 2102 01:37:44,229 --> 01:37:41,330 government does Kathy and I don't have 2103 01:37:46,270 --> 01:37:44,239 radar systems in our backyard you know 2104 01:37:48,190 --> 01:37:46,280 we don't have airplanes with instruments 2105 01:37:49,750 --> 01:37:48,200 ready to chase a UFO to make 2106 01:37:53,380 --> 01:37:49,760 measurements of the electromagnetic 2107 01:37:58,930 --> 01:37:53,390 signature so it's is the one that should 2108 01:38:01,150 --> 01:37:58,940 be foi ade but you can't fya the NRO I'm 2109 01:38:06,430 --> 01:38:01,160 just gonna say try it you won't find 2110 01:38:09,040 --> 01:38:06,440 anything no look this is where again 2111 01:38:12,550 --> 01:38:09,050 that come back to majestic 12 because of 2112 01:38:14,290 --> 01:38:12,560 General Bolander we have to say so okay 2113 01:38:16,270 --> 01:38:14,300 if Bluebook wasn't getting the stuff 2114 01:38:21,520 --> 01:38:16,280 that could affect national security 2115 01:38:24,340 --> 01:38:21,530 where was it going and I say mj-12 very 2116 01:38:26,590 --> 01:38:24,350 simple very straightforward you don't 2117 01:38:31,000 --> 01:38:26,600 need three different groups here Navy 2118 01:38:32,860 --> 01:38:31,010 and Army to look at good UFO data you 2119 01:38:35,260 --> 01:38:32,870 need somebody who can look at the pieces 2120 01:38:37,690 --> 01:38:35,270 of crash saucers you need somebody who 2121 01:38:41,200 --> 01:38:37,700 can look at the measurements made this 2122 01:38:42,700 --> 01:38:41,210 is one very special group and people 2123 01:38:45,400 --> 01:38:42,710 that old governments can't keep secrets 2124 01:38:47,530 --> 01:38:45,410 I can't keep reading from the ancient 2125 01:38:48,970 --> 01:38:47,540 academics and fossilized physicists that 2126 01:38:52,090 --> 01:38:48,980 governments can't keep secrets in 2127 01:38:54,780 --> 01:38:52,100 today's world with the internet who 2128 01:38:57,220 --> 01:38:54,790 could keep the secret it's easy 2129 01:38:59,890 --> 01:38:57,230 they think everything that's not a blog 2130 01:39:01,979 --> 01:38:59,900 is everything that goes on is on a blog 2131 01:39:05,050 --> 01:39:01,989 and on the Internet which is nonsense 2132 01:39:07,060 --> 01:39:05,060 all right so again you know we're 2133 01:39:09,729 --> 01:39:07,070 assuming a few things here obviously 2134 01:39:12,190 --> 01:39:09,739 they know more about what's going on but 2135 01:39:14,050 --> 01:39:12,200 do all the governments of Earth or at 2136 01:39:16,060 --> 01:39:14,060 least the advanced countries know 2137 01:39:19,360 --> 01:39:16,070 essentially the same thing wouldn't 2138 01:39:22,270 --> 01:39:19,370 there be some would they have to share 2139 01:39:25,630 --> 01:39:22,280 information based on no security no I 2140 01:39:27,670 --> 01:39:25,640 would say in today's world that's why 2141 01:39:29,560 --> 01:39:27,680 one of the reasons I haven't jumped on 2142 01:39:32,110 --> 01:39:29,570 the disclosure bandwagon I think there's 2143 01:39:35,020 --> 01:39:32,120 some legitimate national security things 2144 01:39:37,000 --> 01:39:35,030 here how the saucers work what materials 2145 01:39:38,590 --> 01:39:37,010 they're made out of what we've learned 2146 01:39:40,690 --> 01:39:38,600 about the intentions of the beings 2147 01:39:43,029 --> 01:39:40,700 should we put it out if the Russians and 2148 01:39:46,390 --> 01:39:43,039 Chinese don't put out what they have 2149 01:39:48,910 --> 01:39:46,400 it'd be crazy there are legitimate 2150 01:39:51,129 --> 01:39:48,920 national security secrets here 2151 01:39:53,500 --> 01:39:51,139 technology being one I mean bombs were 2152 01:39:56,080 --> 01:39:53,510 important in world war two and would 2153 01:39:59,080 --> 01:39:56,090 certainly be important now and detection 2154 01:40:03,100 --> 01:39:59,090 of airplanes and rockets those are 2155 01:40:04,779 --> 01:40:03,110 important things we got a big well the 2156 01:40:07,959 --> 01:40:04,789 planet is spending a trillion dollars 2157 01:40:10,739 --> 01:40:07,969 this year the people on the planet on 2158 01:40:13,589 --> 01:40:10,749 things military a trillion dollars 2159 01:40:16,509 --> 01:40:13,599 that's a huge amount of money and 2160 01:40:19,799 --> 01:40:16,519 secrecy is part of that okay we 2161 01:40:24,339 --> 01:40:19,809 understand national security reasons but 2162 01:40:28,660 --> 01:40:24,349 UFOs know no boundaries in terms of 2163 01:40:30,219 --> 01:40:28,670 borders so whatever happens here in the 2164 01:40:33,819 --> 01:40:30,229 US there are sightings all around the 2165 01:40:35,500 --> 01:40:33,829 world you can't keep that a secret well 2166 01:40:37,419 --> 01:40:35,510 you can keep the good data you obtained 2167 01:40:40,959 --> 01:40:37,429 with instruments and sophisticated 2168 01:40:44,459 --> 01:40:40,969 observers a secret you can fill the 2169 01:40:53,799 --> 01:40:44,469 world with ridicule happens all the time 2170 01:40:56,830 --> 01:40:53,809 yeah just look at our election our 2171 01:41:00,189 --> 01:40:56,840 Loosli I think that we would all agree 2172 01:41:05,370 --> 01:41:00,199 that disclosure is going on all around 2173 01:41:10,330 --> 01:41:05,380 us you know MUFON various whistleblowers 2174 01:41:15,149 --> 01:41:10,340 people who are in the UFO field people 2175 01:41:18,729 --> 01:41:15,159 who are researchers are and and some 2176 01:41:24,100 --> 01:41:18,739 politicians even haven't disclosed the 2177 01:41:27,390 --> 01:41:24,110 et presence but the thing that is not 2178 01:41:29,560 --> 01:41:27,400 occurring is there is no official 2179 01:41:32,919 --> 01:41:29,570 disclosure from the head of any 2180 01:41:35,649 --> 01:41:32,929 government well this is the other 2181 01:41:37,330 --> 01:41:35,659 question here if there's hardly 2182 01:41:41,069 --> 01:41:37,340 disclosure it's not going to be because 2183 01:41:43,569 --> 01:41:41,079 Stephen Bassett sends 10,000 petitions 2184 01:41:44,890 --> 01:41:43,579 to the press agree with you it's not 2185 01:41:48,129 --> 01:41:44,900 gonna happen that way it can't happen 2186 01:41:50,830 --> 01:41:48,139 that way if there's gonna be disclosure 2187 01:41:54,219 --> 01:41:50,840 this is what they know and we can debate 2188 01:41:55,509 --> 01:41:54,229 what's really known till the cows come 2189 01:41:56,680 --> 01:41:55,519 home we don't know where till hell 2190 01:41:59,620 --> 01:41:56,690 freezes over 2191 01:42:01,120 --> 01:41:59,630 we don't know exactly what they know but 2192 01:42:04,210 --> 01:42:01,130 if they have this sort of knowledge 2193 01:42:07,600 --> 01:42:04,220 about ET visitation or visitation from 2194 01:42:10,300 --> 01:42:07,610 anywhere where is the imperative for 2195 01:42:12,850 --> 01:42:10,310 them to tell us anything unless number 2196 01:42:15,100 --> 01:42:12,860 one we had to act out of national 2197 01:42:17,830 --> 01:42:15,110 security in a way that would become 2198 01:42:20,590 --> 01:42:17,840 public anyway otherwise why say a darn 2199 01:42:22,930 --> 01:42:20,600 thing or the other question being if 2200 01:42:24,880 --> 01:42:22,940 there was disclosure what about the 2201 01:42:28,600 --> 01:42:24,890 consequences what about the oil 2202 01:42:31,660 --> 01:42:28,610 industries there is this absolutely race 2203 01:42:34,450 --> 01:42:31,670 from religion religion sure you know 2204 01:42:36,610 --> 01:42:34,460 what if you ask ET what do you think 2205 01:42:38,920 --> 01:42:36,620 what is your view of God and they say 2206 01:42:40,780 --> 01:42:38,930 what are you talking about you know it 2207 01:42:43,510 --> 01:42:40,790 comes out to that whatever it is we have 2208 01:42:45,130 --> 01:42:43,520 no idea what kind of religion an alien 2209 01:42:48,660 --> 01:42:45,140 race would have or even if they even 2210 01:42:51,490 --> 01:42:48,670 understood the concept there are major 2211 01:42:53,440 --> 01:42:51,500 consequences you hit a very important 2212 01:42:54,820 --> 01:42:53,450 point and that's something that the 2213 01:42:57,580 --> 01:42:54,830 disclosure people aren't talking about 2214 01:43:00,340 --> 01:42:57,590 really right that's kind of goes back to 2215 01:43:02,290 --> 01:43:00,350 major Donald Kehoe again he said the 2216 01:43:06,340 --> 01:43:02,300 same thing you know whatever it is we 2217 01:43:09,130 --> 01:43:06,350 can take it you know we'll we'll accept 2218 01:43:11,230 --> 01:43:09,140 whatever is to come but if there is a 2219 01:43:13,990 --> 01:43:11,240 slightest danger of anything bad 2220 01:43:17,140 --> 01:43:14,000 happening and certainly the oil industry 2221 01:43:19,060 --> 01:43:17,150 is one energy in general anything 2222 01:43:21,610 --> 01:43:19,070 related to technology that is shown to 2223 01:43:23,410 --> 01:43:21,620 be completely obsolete anything related 2224 01:43:27,100 --> 01:43:23,420 to our political systems the 2225 01:43:31,180 --> 01:43:27,110 implications of this kind of presence 2226 01:43:33,970 --> 01:43:31,190 would be so vast yeah I can't see an 2227 01:43:36,880 --> 01:43:33,980 imperative to let it out except for the 2228 01:43:38,890 --> 01:43:36,890 one of logic which is well this secret 2229 01:43:39,310 --> 01:43:38,900 can't be kept forever we can try our 2230 01:43:43,900 --> 01:43:39,320 best 2231 01:43:46,980 --> 01:43:43,910 maybe gradual disclosure let the secret 2232 01:43:49,750 --> 01:43:46,990 out very very slowly let the people 2233 01:43:52,540 --> 01:43:49,760 accept the fact that there is very 2234 01:43:54,480 --> 01:43:52,550 likely life in outer space plentiful 2235 01:43:56,770 --> 01:43:54,490 life in outer space whatever and 2236 01:43:58,690 --> 01:43:56,780 eventually we wake up and we realize 2237 01:44:01,420 --> 01:43:58,700 it's happened but it doesn't happen 2238 01:44:04,690 --> 01:44:01,430 overnight unless there's a press of 2239 01:44:07,390 --> 01:44:04,700 events that there's an et visitation 2240 01:44:10,120 --> 01:44:07,400 obviously they whoever they are don't 2241 01:44:13,060 --> 01:44:10,130 care they don't care if there see 2242 01:44:16,030 --> 01:44:13,070 flying around they don't care to stop 2243 01:44:18,729 --> 01:44:16,040 and disclose who they are unless we have 2244 01:44:20,080 --> 01:44:18,739 certain contacts that are genuine even 2245 01:44:26,439 --> 01:44:20,090 with abductions 2246 01:44:30,070 --> 01:44:26,449 take it serious Oh doesn't matter they 2247 01:44:36,310 --> 01:44:30,080 appear to care enough not to show up in 2248 01:44:38,709 --> 01:44:36,320 large numbers so very public places yes 2249 01:44:43,000 --> 01:44:38,719 you know well they did show up over 2250 01:44:46,840 --> 01:44:43,010 Washington DC in 1952 they did show up 2251 01:44:50,979 --> 01:44:46,850 over Phoenix and in a number of places 2252 01:44:54,430 --> 01:44:50,989 of course we had denial immediately 2253 01:44:57,970 --> 01:44:54,440 following that but you know so maybe 2254 01:45:02,950 --> 01:44:57,980 this is a test to determine what public 2255 01:45:05,860 --> 01:45:02,960 reaction might be and maybe even to test 2256 01:45:10,450 --> 01:45:05,870 how what political or military action 2257 01:45:14,830 --> 01:45:10,460 might be but imagine the public reaction 2258 01:45:17,830 --> 01:45:14,840 that we would have if a thousand UFOs 2259 01:45:19,899 --> 01:45:17,840 showed up over major cities around the 2260 01:45:23,560 --> 01:45:19,909 world it would be quite different I 2261 01:45:25,959 --> 01:45:23,570 believe more so than Independence Day 2262 01:45:28,030 --> 01:45:25,969 we've got Stanton Friedman Kathleen 2263 01:45:30,280 --> 01:45:28,040 Martin a few questions from listeners 2264 01:45:34,610 --> 01:45:30,290 with Jean and Chris you're in libera 2265 01:45:34,620 --> 01:45:39,300 [Music] 2266 01:45:47,040 --> 01:45:43,960 thank you for listening to GCN be sure 2267 01:45:49,510 --> 01:45:47,050 to visit GCN live.com today 2268 01:45:51,250 --> 01:45:49,520 attack of the rock AIDS has been 2269 01:45:53,260 --> 01:45:51,260 well-received by critics and readers 2270 01:45:56,050 --> 01:45:53,270 alike it's a thrill a minute story 2271 01:45:58,360 --> 01:45:56,060 you'll never forget a former US military 2272 01:46:00,640 --> 01:45:58,370 intelligence officer is haunted by 2273 01:46:03,280 --> 01:46:00,650 intense dreams about a beautiful woman 2274 01:46:06,040 --> 01:46:03,290 pleading for his help after a terrible 2275 01:46:08,290 --> 01:46:06,050 battle in outer space but the dreams 2276 01:46:10,150 --> 01:46:08,300 turn out to be true and thrust him into 2277 01:46:12,850 --> 01:46:10,160 a telepathic love affair with a woman 2278 01:46:15,190 --> 01:46:12,860 whose faraway planet is intent on 2279 01:46:18,040 --> 01:46:15,200 destroying the earth and now the 2280 01:46:20,470 --> 01:46:18,050 gripping tale continues in the coming of 2281 01:46:23,110 --> 01:46:20,480 the protectors it's the second book of 2282 01:46:25,300 --> 01:46:23,120 the Rockets trilogy a galaxy spanning 2283 01:46:28,360 --> 01:46:25,310 adventure that pits our hapless heroes 2284 01:46:30,280 --> 01:46:28,370 against powerful fanatical enemies that 2285 01:46:33,100 --> 01:46:30,290 threaten the lives of freedom loving 2286 01:46:36,580 --> 01:46:33,110 beings everywhere attack of the rockets 2287 01:46:39,310 --> 01:46:36,590 and the coming of the protectors classic 2288 01:46:43,060 --> 01:46:39,320 science fiction at its best available 2289 01:46:49,840 --> 01:46:43,070 now for more details visit rawhides calm 2290 01:46:51,910 --> 01:46:49,850 that's our Ock o IDs calm fully cooked 2291 01:46:54,190 --> 01:46:51,920 ready to eat bacon I'm talking thick 2292 01:46:57,190 --> 01:46:54,200 meaty center-cut presidential bacon 2293 01:46:59,560 --> 01:46:57,200 savory and delicious I buy some I use 2294 01:47:01,360 --> 01:46:59,570 some I store some awesome no 2295 01:47:02,200 --> 01:47:01,370 refrigeration needed with a 10 year 2296 01:47:05,320 --> 01:47:02,210 shelf-life 2297 01:47:07,750 --> 01:47:05,330 NASA pack technology bacon fully cooked 2298 01:47:10,050 --> 01:47:07,760 fully hydrated ready to eat right from 2299 01:47:12,880 --> 01:47:10,060 the pack bacon or warm and served 2300 01:47:15,550 --> 01:47:12,890 life-saving ready to eat bacon 10-year 2301 01:47:17,830 --> 01:47:15,560 shelf-life bacon ships free at fully 2302 01:47:20,740 --> 01:47:17,840 cooked bacon calm fully cooked bacon 2303 01:47:22,300 --> 01:47:20,750 calm we use mobile devices right against 2304 01:47:24,100 --> 01:47:22,310 our bodies every day but growing 2305 01:47:25,810 --> 01:47:24,110 scientific evidence has emerged showing 2306 01:47:27,730 --> 01:47:25,820 serious health risks associated with 2307 01:47:29,920 --> 01:47:27,740 exposure to EMF radiation emitted from 2308 01:47:31,390 --> 01:47:29,930 these devices the solution is defender 2309 01:47:32,920 --> 01:47:31,400 shield the most effective mobile 2310 01:47:35,230 --> 01:47:32,930 radiation shielding ever developed 2311 01:47:37,030 --> 01:47:35,240 defender shield blocks virtually 100% of 2312 01:47:40,360 --> 01:47:37,040 EMF radiation from cellphones tablets 2313 01:47:42,640 --> 01:47:40,370 and laptops and starts at just 64 99 by 2314 01:47:45,340 --> 01:47:42,650 with defender shield comm for 10% off 2315 01:47:47,440 --> 01:47:45,350 use promo code GCM defender shield comm 2316 01:47:53,640 --> 01:47:47,450 the worldwide leader in mobile radiation 2317 01:47:59,430 --> 01:47:55,729 [Applause] 2318 01:48:03,770 --> 01:47:59,440 welcome back to the para cast the gold 2319 01:48:12,360 --> 01:48:03,780 standard of paranormal radio and now 2320 01:48:13,950 --> 01:48:12,370 here's Jane Steinberg Chris are there 2321 01:48:15,570 --> 01:48:13,960 any questions from listeners related to 2322 01:48:20,130 --> 01:48:15,580 the disclosure issues since we're on 2323 01:48:21,720 --> 01:48:20,140 that now you know not really there are a 2324 01:48:25,470 --> 01:48:21,730 bunch of good questions here though I 2325 01:48:26,160 --> 01:48:25,480 must say and one from from Randall up in 2326 01:48:28,320 --> 01:48:26,170 Calgary 2327 01:48:31,229 --> 01:48:28,330 ufology as he's known a long time poster 2328 01:48:33,360 --> 01:48:31,239 here at forum dr. Perik asked calm or 2329 01:48:36,689 --> 01:48:33,370 our listeners get a chance to post 2330 01:48:39,660 --> 01:48:36,699 questions at the question Bank and we'll 2331 01:48:42,200 --> 01:48:39,670 ask him of our guests you know I saw a 2332 01:48:44,850 --> 01:48:42,210 an article and this goes out to Kathleen 2333 01:48:48,360 --> 01:48:44,860 Stanton you can also comment if you'd 2334 01:48:50,220 --> 01:48:48,370 like but I saw this is kind of a little 2335 01:48:51,870 --> 01:48:50,230 bit of a change of pace here I think we 2336 01:48:53,700 --> 01:48:51,880 need to kind of move on a little bit 2337 01:48:58,370 --> 01:48:53,710 here because we're running out of time 2338 01:49:01,320 --> 01:48:58,380 but one of the Allagash for from the 2339 01:49:02,820 --> 01:49:01,330 fairly well known abduction up and up in 2340 01:49:04,770 --> 01:49:02,830 Maine 2341 01:49:07,620 --> 01:49:04,780 his name is Chuck Rach he's come out 2342 01:49:12,390 --> 01:49:07,630 publicly and stated that the whole thing 2343 01:49:15,840 --> 01:49:12,400 in his mind is a hoax and I went to the 2344 01:49:19,320 --> 01:49:15,850 news source on this in I think the 2345 01:49:21,120 --> 01:49:19,330 Bangor Maine news and he's claiming that 2346 01:49:24,060 --> 01:49:21,130 the whole thing was they did have a 2347 01:49:27,090 --> 01:49:24,070 sighting but the subsequent events that 2348 01:49:30,120 --> 01:49:27,100 were brought forth from the other three 2349 01:49:33,540 --> 01:49:30,130 witnesses the two brothers and what was 2350 01:49:42,890 --> 01:49:33,550 his name Chuck I actually met him sweet 2351 01:49:47,400 --> 01:49:42,900 guy Jim Weiner well Charlie oh and 2352 01:49:48,150 --> 01:49:47,410 Charlie folks I met him one time really 2353 01:49:50,820 --> 01:49:48,160 sweet guy 2354 01:49:54,150 --> 01:49:50,830 well according to Chuck Rach he feels 2355 01:49:56,040 --> 01:49:54,160 that all that was basically all the 2356 01:49:58,680 --> 01:49:56,050 hypnotic regression stuff was was 2357 01:50:00,209 --> 01:49:58,690 creative storytelling and he is now 2358 01:50:03,450 --> 01:50:00,219 saying that he feels that the whole 2359 01:50:04,950 --> 01:50:03,460 thing should be considered a hoax you do 2360 01:50:07,649 --> 01:50:04,960 either if you have any comments on that 2361 01:50:11,459 --> 01:50:07,659 Kathleen first I do because I have 2362 01:50:14,810 --> 01:50:11,469 interviewed Charlie Fults and Jim Wiener 2363 01:50:18,840 --> 01:50:14,820 and this topic of was brought up and 2364 01:50:21,990 --> 01:50:18,850 what I was told is that Chuck Rack was 2365 01:50:24,629 --> 01:50:22,000 asked why he had come out and and made 2366 01:50:27,780 --> 01:50:24,639 that statement and he said well he 2367 01:50:31,110 --> 01:50:27,790 thought that it would be good to cause 2368 01:50:34,020 --> 01:50:31,120 controversy that it would bring interest 2369 01:50:38,129 --> 01:50:34,030 to the case which makes absolutely no 2370 01:50:41,280 --> 01:50:38,139 sense to me I think that he's kind of a 2371 01:50:45,209 --> 01:50:41,290 strange character I do believe that 2372 01:50:49,740 --> 01:50:45,219 Charlie faults and Jim Weiner are 2373 01:50:52,260 --> 01:50:49,750 absolutely sincere and honest I have 2374 01:50:55,020 --> 01:50:52,270 interviewed both of them at length I 2375 01:50:58,620 --> 01:50:55,030 know both of them and I believe that the 2376 01:51:02,879 --> 01:50:58,630 story happened as they remembered it 2377 01:51:05,490 --> 01:51:02,889 they were hypnotized separately and they 2378 01:51:08,129 --> 01:51:05,500 did not have a bleed through of 2379 01:51:11,970 --> 01:51:08,139 information the information was not 2380 01:51:15,450 --> 01:51:11,980 contaminated and they told essentially 2381 01:51:19,379 --> 01:51:15,460 the same story I do believe that it was 2382 01:51:20,879 --> 01:51:19,389 real good enough for me okay so so that 2383 01:51:23,820 --> 01:51:20,889 leads me to another question there and 2384 01:51:27,149 --> 01:51:23,830 Lassen what other cases do you believe 2385 01:51:30,689 --> 01:51:27,159 with 100% certainty of abduction cases 2386 01:51:33,180 --> 01:51:30,699 are real which other cases if you could 2387 01:51:37,470 --> 01:51:33,190 give us some examples okay I'm not going 2388 01:51:42,540 --> 01:51:37,480 to say 100% certainty because I base my 2389 01:51:45,570 --> 01:51:42,550 opinion on probability ratios but cases 2390 01:51:48,419 --> 01:51:45,580 that I find highly probable are the 2391 01:51:52,410 --> 01:51:48,429 Betty and Barney Hill case the Travis 2392 01:51:58,110 --> 01:51:52,420 Walton case there were three women in 2393 01:52:00,959 --> 01:51:58,120 Kentucky who were taken in 1976 not only 2394 01:52:05,310 --> 01:52:00,969 a couple of months after Travis Walton 2395 01:52:08,820 --> 01:52:05,320 they have a compelling story to and even 2396 01:52:13,200 --> 01:52:08,830 the Linda Cortile case that has received 2397 01:52:16,169 --> 01:52:13,210 so much criticism I do do believe that 2398 01:52:18,840 --> 01:52:16,179 it has a high probability of having 2399 01:52:20,360 --> 01:52:18,850 occurred when you know the real facts 2400 01:52:22,670 --> 01:52:20,370 behind it and I have 2401 01:52:23,990 --> 01:52:22,680 also interviewed her yeah let me just 2402 01:52:26,300 --> 01:52:24,000 stop with that because we've had a lot 2403 01:52:29,420 --> 01:52:26,310 of debate in the forums about that case 2404 01:52:31,760 --> 01:52:29,430 and I think part of it is well on the 2405 01:52:33,590 --> 01:52:31,770 Brooklyn Bridge what is this we would 2406 01:52:36,890 --> 01:52:33,600 have seen something what are the 2407 01:52:40,570 --> 01:52:36,900 misconceptions that people have about 2408 01:52:44,150 --> 01:52:40,580 that case the misconceptions are that 2409 01:52:48,050 --> 01:52:44,160 not many people did see it and in fact 2410 01:52:52,340 --> 01:52:48,060 many people came forward to Budd Hopkins 2411 01:52:55,220 --> 01:52:52,350 and wrote letters and stated that they 2412 01:52:57,860 --> 01:52:55,230 did see this some people thought that it 2413 01:53:02,060 --> 01:52:57,870 was a movie being filmed in the middle 2414 01:53:05,210 --> 01:53:02,070 of the night but so people did not want 2415 01:53:08,030 --> 01:53:05,220 to use their names you have to remember 2416 01:53:13,490 --> 01:53:08,040 that Philip Glass did such a wonderful 2417 01:53:16,010 --> 01:53:13,500 job of smearing anybody who reported 2418 01:53:19,160 --> 01:53:16,020 this kind of thing they could lose their 2419 01:53:21,890 --> 01:53:19,170 jobs they lost their credibility their 2420 01:53:25,190 --> 01:53:21,900 lives were miserable they would be 2421 01:53:28,550 --> 01:53:25,200 taunted by him bothered by him for the 2422 01:53:33,550 --> 01:53:28,560 rest of his life and who would want to 2423 01:53:38,030 --> 01:53:33,560 go forward with and testify to this if 2424 01:53:41,120 --> 01:53:38,040 they might be harmed for doing so so you 2425 01:53:48,650 --> 01:53:41,130 think that pressure has kept all these 2426 01:53:52,430 --> 01:53:48,660 people from coming forward not revealed 2427 01:53:56,990 --> 01:53:52,440 their identities so you have to base it 2428 01:53:58,190 --> 01:53:57,000 upon your belief that Budd Hopkins was 2429 01:54:02,720 --> 01:53:58,200 telling the truth 2430 01:54:05,480 --> 01:54:02,730 and I do believe that he was telling the 2431 01:54:09,260 --> 01:54:05,490 truth I do not believe that he 2432 01:54:10,700 --> 01:54:09,270 embellished this story why do you think 2433 01:54:14,840 --> 01:54:10,710 some people have made it their mission 2434 01:54:17,120 --> 01:54:14,850 in life right or wrong to go after Budd 2435 01:54:18,590 --> 01:54:17,130 Hopkins and dr. David Jacobs it's not a 2436 01:54:21,260 --> 01:54:18,600 question of whether you believe what 2437 01:54:23,360 --> 01:54:21,270 they did resolve anything 2438 01:54:26,000 --> 01:54:23,370 if you accept their theories or not 2439 01:54:30,080 --> 01:54:26,010 that's not the point why is it become so 2440 01:54:32,000 --> 01:54:30,090 personal it makes people rethink what 2441 01:54:34,960 --> 01:54:32,010 they've always thought to be true and 2442 01:54:37,310 --> 01:54:34,970 sudden that we're alone for exam 2443 01:54:40,850 --> 01:54:37,320 I remember meeting somebody on an 2444 01:54:44,330 --> 01:54:40,860 airplane and we got to talking and he 2445 01:54:46,040 --> 01:54:44,340 was totally a obscenity notion that 2446 01:54:48,920 --> 01:54:46,050 anybody could think there are other 2447 01:54:53,540 --> 01:54:48,930 beings out there the Bible doesn't say 2448 01:54:55,850 --> 01:54:53,550 so he used that term so that it's a 2449 01:54:59,120 --> 01:54:55,860 matter of national security some people 2450 01:55:03,050 --> 01:54:59,130 feel that it's their civic duty to deny 2451 01:55:07,190 --> 01:55:03,060 this other people will deny it out of 2452 01:55:10,700 --> 01:55:07,200 fear other people will deny it for 2453 01:55:12,880 --> 01:55:10,710 personal reasons have to change how you 2454 01:55:15,290 --> 01:55:12,890 think about the world of we're actually 2455 01:55:18,800 --> 01:55:15,300 being visited and we're not the big 2456 01:55:20,630 --> 01:55:18,810 shots we'd like to think we I think 2457 01:55:23,090 --> 01:55:20,640 though it gets more personal than that 2458 01:55:25,490 --> 01:55:23,100 with these two individuals it's not just 2459 01:55:28,880 --> 01:55:25,500 well I don't believe we could possibly 2460 01:55:31,700 --> 01:55:28,890 have had people abducted by aliens it's 2461 01:55:34,100 --> 01:55:31,710 more than that it's so personal it's 2462 01:55:37,130 --> 01:55:34,110 about these individuals and who and what 2463 01:55:38,780 --> 01:55:37,140 they were mean but or you mean the 2464 01:55:42,110 --> 01:55:38,790 people who don't I'm thinking in terms 2465 01:55:45,260 --> 01:55:42,120 of dr. Jacobs we had David Jacobs on the 2466 01:55:49,070 --> 01:55:45,270 power cast a couple of years back I've 2467 01:55:52,090 --> 01:55:49,080 never seen any episode so polarized and 2468 01:55:55,760 --> 01:55:52,100 we had before and we had discussions and 2469 01:55:58,580 --> 01:55:55,770 it was fine but this time it was people 2470 01:56:00,530 --> 01:55:58,590 threatening to give up the para cast 2471 01:56:03,200 --> 01:56:00,540 threatening to cancel their memberships 2472 01:56:06,470 --> 01:56:03,210 and para cast plus threatening to punish 2473 01:56:09,260 --> 01:56:06,480 us for putting this guy on the air some 2474 01:56:11,810 --> 01:56:09,270 very strong points of view and he has 2475 01:56:14,830 --> 01:56:11,820 recently come out with his new book 2476 01:56:17,480 --> 01:56:14,840 walking among us where he has 2477 01:56:22,370 --> 01:56:17,490 interviewed several people under 2478 01:56:26,290 --> 01:56:22,380 hypnosis and as a result has stated that 2479 01:56:29,720 --> 01:56:26,300 he believes that the hybridization 2480 01:56:34,570 --> 01:56:29,730 program has reached another level and 2481 01:56:37,520 --> 01:56:34,580 that that is to replace mankind 2482 01:56:39,850 --> 01:56:37,530 essentially that is a very frightening 2483 01:56:43,220 --> 01:56:39,860 statement a lot of people certainly 2484 01:56:47,240 --> 01:56:43,230 would not want to believe that that is 2485 01:56:50,120 --> 01:56:47,250 true he he would have to provide 2486 01:56:53,240 --> 01:56:50,130 very good evidence to back that up which 2487 01:56:57,590 --> 01:56:53,250 many people feel that he has not 2488 01:57:01,810 --> 01:56:57,600 provided so I think that it's pretty 2489 01:57:04,880 --> 01:57:01,820 easy to criticize him on that point 2490 01:57:07,370 --> 01:57:04,890 because there is a burden of proof and 2491 01:57:10,070 --> 01:57:07,380 that's based upon the level of evidence 2492 01:57:13,610 --> 01:57:10,080 that you have and he has not submitted 2493 01:57:16,760 --> 01:57:13,620 the level of evidence required to 2494 01:57:18,050 --> 01:57:16,770 believe that that is going to happen I'm 2495 01:57:20,630 --> 01:57:18,060 going to ask you quickly about the 2496 01:57:23,210 --> 01:57:20,640 conclusion though via Kathleen Martin 2497 01:57:25,280 --> 01:57:23,220 we've got Stanton Friedman the book is 2498 01:57:26,960 --> 01:57:25,290 fact fiction and flying saucers only 2499 01:57:29,330 --> 01:57:26,970 three segments left there's more 2500 01:57:31,190 --> 01:57:29,340 questions from listeners that we'll get 2501 01:57:33,020 --> 01:57:31,200 to I just wanted to focus on one thing 2502 01:57:39,010 --> 01:57:33,030 before we get there with Jeana and Chris 2503 01:57:49,470 --> 01:57:46,310 [Music] 2504 01:57:51,899 --> 01:57:49,480 the award-winning graphic converter 10 2505 01:57:54,810 --> 01:57:51,909 the universal genius for photo editing 2506 01:57:57,750 --> 01:57:54,820 apps on your Mac join over one and a 2507 01:58:00,359 --> 01:57:57,760 half million loyal users for the Swiss 2508 01:58:02,370 --> 01:58:00,369 Army knife app that gives you all the 2509 01:58:05,490 --> 01:58:02,380 features that you expect and most 2510 01:58:10,950 --> 01:58:05,500 important it's easy to use you can get 2511 01:58:17,580 --> 01:58:10,960 it for just 3995 from wwl my soft calm 2512 01:58:19,620 --> 01:58:17,590 ATS wle Mk II soft calm as you know 2513 01:58:22,439 --> 01:58:19,630 neighbor's web hosting can be pretty 2514 01:58:25,709 --> 01:58:22,449 cheap but not all hosting is the same 2515 01:58:28,439 --> 01:58:25,719 dream host wins best of awards year 2516 01:58:31,290 --> 01:58:28,449 after year you get unlimited disk space 2517 01:58:33,379 --> 01:58:31,300 unlimited bandwidth and even the low 2518 01:58:36,479 --> 01:58:33,389 cost plans put your sights on 2519 01:58:38,970 --> 01:58:36,489 high-performance SSDs well I know more 2520 01:58:42,030 --> 01:58:38,980 about what dreamhost has to offer go to 2521 01:58:46,410 --> 01:58:42,040 tech night out comm slash host once 2522 01:58:48,660 --> 01:58:46,420 again that's tech nikon comm slash host 2523 01:58:50,100 --> 01:58:48,670 hi there this is dr. Joel Wallach the 2524 01:58:52,200 --> 01:58:50,110 dead times don't lie guy and we're 2525 01:58:54,870 --> 01:58:52,210 looking in this time of terrible 2526 01:58:56,609 --> 01:58:54,880 financial crash terrible meltdown to the 2527 01:58:58,649 --> 01:58:56,619 medical system we're looking to pay 2528 01:59:00,149 --> 01:58:58,659 people I've seen amounts of money if you 2529 01:59:01,680 --> 01:59:00,159 become a student of our business at 2530 01:59:03,180 --> 01:59:01,690 youngevity we will help you actually 2531 01:59:04,919 --> 01:59:03,190 take care of people better than the 2532 01:59:06,540 --> 01:59:04,929 medical system has think about it we 2533 01:59:08,790 --> 01:59:06,550 spend more money in America for health 2534 01:59:10,200 --> 01:59:08,800 care than all the other 218 nations are 2535 01:59:12,180 --> 01:59:10,210 all put together and they can't even 2536 01:59:13,859 --> 01:59:12,190 solve weight loss problems I mean the 2537 01:59:16,649 --> 01:59:13,869 medical system if you have a total 2538 01:59:18,089 --> 01:59:16,659 mental brain fart and if you do this you 2539 01:59:20,010 --> 01:59:18,099 will be able to save an enormous amount 2540 01:59:21,750 --> 01:59:20,020 of people from being overweight being 2541 01:59:23,910 --> 01:59:21,760 obese they don't even know what causes 2542 01:59:26,339 --> 01:59:23,920 obesity believe me we know what causes 2543 01:59:28,200 --> 01:59:26,349 obesity in the medical system they think 2544 01:59:29,729 --> 01:59:28,210 it's from eating too much it's not from 2545 01:59:32,100 --> 01:59:29,739 eating too much it's actually a mineral 2546 01:59:33,569 --> 01:59:32,110 deficiency do you solve a tyrant 2547 01:59:34,500 --> 01:59:33,579 efficiency anemia with a bone-marrow 2548 01:59:36,300 --> 01:59:34,510 transplant 2549 01:59:37,919 --> 01:59:36,310 that's what they think do you solve a 2550 01:59:39,629 --> 01:59:37,929 mineral deficiency that causes obesity 2551 01:59:41,790 --> 01:59:39,639 with a 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02:00:44,340 can break and the metal fragments can 2580 02:00:48,649 --> 02:00:46,139 travel to your heart or lungs causing 2581 02:00:51,080 --> 02:00:48,659 serious injuries if you or a loved one 2582 02:00:53,629 --> 02:00:51,090 suffered organ damage or other injuries 2583 02:00:55,520 --> 02:00:53,639 from an IVC filter you may be entitled 2584 02:00:58,850 --> 02:00:55,530 to substantial financial compensation 2585 02:01:00,979 --> 02:00:58,860 act now time is limited to file a claim 2586 02:01:12,669 --> 02:01:00,989 for a free consultation and free 2587 02:01:16,100 --> 02:01:14,750 847-537-7000 a spokesperson injury help 2588 02:01:17,779 --> 02:01:16,110 desk comm is responsible for this 2589 02:01:20,000 --> 02:01:17,789 advertisement principal office Las Vegas 2590 02:01:21,560 --> 02:01:20,010 Nevada in these uncertain times it makes 2591 02:01:23,330 --> 02:01:21,570 sense to have a sustainable backup 2592 02:01:25,339 --> 02:01:23,340 method to cook food and boil water if 2593 02:01:27,020 --> 02:01:25,349 your current plan includes using a fuel 2594 02:01:29,270 --> 02:01:27,030 burning stove or cooking over an open 2595 02:01:31,159 --> 02:01:29,280 fire then there's a much better way the 2596 02:01:33,199 --> 02:01:31,169 Minuteman rocket stove is a biomass 2597 02:01:35,239 --> 02:01:33,209 burning cooking stove that only requires 2598 02:01:37,339 --> 02:01:35,249 small quantities of sticks and twigs for 2599 02:01:39,080 --> 02:01:37,349 fuel the Minuteman stove is easy to use 2600 02:01:41,060 --> 02:01:39,090 smokeless portable powerful and 2601 02:01:42,889 --> 02:01:41,070 sustainable for the finest and survival 2602 02:01:44,989 --> 02:01:42,899 cooking stoves and fire starters made 2603 02:01:49,770 --> 02:01:44,999 right here in the USA go to Minuteman 2604 02:01:54,760 --> 02:01:52,750 we'd like to hear from you if you have a 2605 02:01:58,450 --> 02:01:54,770 comment or question about the para cast 2606 02:02:02,020 --> 02:01:58,460 sent it to news at the para cast com 2607 02:02:04,149 --> 02:02:02,030 that's news at the para cast dot-com and 2608 02:02:07,330 --> 02:02:04,159 don't forget to visit our famous para 2609 02:02:10,140 --> 02:02:07,340 cast community forums at forum dot the 2610 02:02:13,000 --> 02:02:10,150 para cast dot-com 2611 02:02:15,189 --> 02:02:13,010 okay that's Chris of course he's under 2612 02:02:16,979 --> 02:02:15,199 some kind of spell when he does that we 2613 02:02:19,419 --> 02:02:16,989 haven't figured out what spell or 2614 02:02:21,879 --> 02:02:19,429 whether he's spelling anything but we'll 2615 02:02:26,229 --> 02:02:21,889 have to continue here the fundamental 2616 02:02:29,859 --> 02:02:26,239 premise that Jacobs presents Kathleen is 2617 02:02:33,160 --> 02:02:29,869 about hybrids that's not just aliens 2618 02:02:34,510 --> 02:02:33,170 experimenting with our DNA it's hubris 2619 02:02:37,859 --> 02:02:34,520 it's both 2620 02:02:42,780 --> 02:02:37,869 what's hubris and hybrid suits okay 2621 02:02:46,540 --> 02:02:42,790 regardless hubris hybrids whatever it is 2622 02:02:49,629 --> 02:02:46,550 they're creating a race of invaders 2623 02:02:54,250 --> 02:02:49,639 silent invaders who are taking over that 2624 02:02:58,540 --> 02:02:54,260 et is here to take over the human race 2625 02:03:01,859 --> 02:02:58,550 in a way that doesn't require killing 2626 02:03:04,930 --> 02:03:01,869 anybody I guess doesn't require mass 2627 02:03:08,020 --> 02:03:04,940 laziness is a sleeper 2628 02:03:10,510 --> 02:03:08,030 it is a sleeper campaign do you believe 2629 02:03:13,390 --> 02:03:10,520 Kathleen any such thing to possibly be 2630 02:03:17,680 --> 02:03:13,400 happening what I have to say is that 2631 02:03:21,490 --> 02:03:17,690 David Jacobs hypothesis is not backed up 2632 02:03:26,229 --> 02:03:21,500 by any researcher that I know of it's 2633 02:03:28,899 --> 02:03:26,239 not backed up by my own research and I'm 2634 02:03:31,930 --> 02:03:28,909 an independent researcher I'm also the 2635 02:03:35,470 --> 02:03:31,940 director of muffins experience or 2636 02:03:38,729 --> 02:03:35,480 research team and I've done a great deal 2637 02:03:44,560 --> 02:03:38,739 of research in this it appears that 2638 02:03:48,040 --> 02:03:44,570 there is genetic manipulation that by 2639 02:03:51,370 --> 02:03:48,050 these ETS that they do have a purpose 2640 02:03:54,180 --> 02:03:51,380 for doing this but all of the other 2641 02:03:56,950 --> 02:03:54,190 researchers that I know of and myself 2642 02:04:00,580 --> 02:03:56,960 believe that this is taking place very 2643 02:04:02,070 --> 02:04:00,590 slowly and that the genetic manipulation 2644 02:04:05,950 --> 02:04:02,080 is too human 2645 02:04:08,260 --> 02:04:05,960 babies that are born to human parents 2646 02:04:11,650 --> 02:04:08,270 there might be a hybridization process 2647 02:04:14,050 --> 02:04:11,660 in there for this experimentation but 2648 02:04:17,280 --> 02:04:14,060 these children are being born to human 2649 02:04:20,650 --> 02:04:17,290 parents and raised in human society the 2650 02:04:23,860 --> 02:04:20,660 difficulty that I have with the idea 2651 02:04:26,650 --> 02:04:23,870 that hubris human-looking hybrids are 2652 02:04:29,740 --> 02:04:26,660 coming to earth in their late teens or 2653 02:04:35,230 --> 02:04:29,750 early 20s knowing absolutely nothing 2654 02:04:38,470 --> 02:04:35,240 about life on this planet having none of 2655 02:04:41,350 --> 02:04:38,480 the subtle gestures that we have none of 2656 02:04:44,290 --> 02:04:41,360 the information that we have learned 2657 02:04:46,540 --> 02:04:44,300 from the time we were born about human 2658 02:04:50,020 --> 02:04:46,550 interaction and how to live as a human 2659 02:04:53,500 --> 02:04:50,030 being and then are suddenly thrust into 2660 02:04:57,060 --> 02:04:53,510 our society to try to make it with a 2661 02:05:01,090 --> 02:04:57,070 little bit of in intervention from 2662 02:05:03,970 --> 02:05:01,100 unwilling experiencers who are taken 2663 02:05:08,110 --> 02:05:03,980 during the night and training these 2664 02:05:11,440 --> 02:05:08,120 individuals to live on earth is an idea 2665 02:05:14,470 --> 02:05:11,450 that that I cannot accept I have a great 2666 02:05:17,500 --> 02:05:14,480 deal of respect for David for his work 2667 02:05:19,780 --> 02:05:17,510 he has made great strides in his 2668 02:05:23,440 --> 02:05:19,790 research and in his work with Budd 2669 02:05:29,760 --> 02:05:23,450 Hopkins but when it comes to the idea 2670 02:05:33,310 --> 02:05:29,770 that hubris who are very very naive to 2671 02:05:37,270 --> 02:05:33,320 everything human are coming here and 2672 02:05:40,230 --> 02:05:37,280 setting up residence it's beyond what I 2673 02:05:43,270 --> 02:05:40,240 can accept first yes there's no evidence 2674 02:05:45,790 --> 02:05:43,280 there's no evidence for it and this kind 2675 02:05:47,590 --> 02:05:45,800 of leads me to a question I've noticed 2676 02:05:49,420 --> 02:05:47,600 in the past four or five years that 2677 02:05:52,000 --> 02:05:49,430 we're seeing you know there's always 2678 02:05:55,030 --> 02:05:52,010 been this kind of battle between the the 2679 02:05:59,320 --> 02:05:55,040 evil Reptoids coming to enslave us eat 2680 02:06:01,540 --> 02:05:59,330 us you know regardless as cattle and 2681 02:06:03,790 --> 02:06:01,550 then the benevolent space brother side 2682 02:06:07,780 --> 02:06:03,800 of the equation there's always been this 2683 02:06:12,550 --> 02:06:07,790 world dichotomy and I'm wondering if I'm 2684 02:06:14,260 --> 02:06:12,560 seeing a shift from it seems like the 2685 02:06:15,440 --> 02:06:14,270 negative side of the abduction 2686 02:06:17,990 --> 02:06:15,450 phenomenon is 2687 02:06:20,660 --> 02:06:18,000 is becoming less and less popular and 2688 02:06:23,470 --> 02:06:20,670 you see more of a leaning on the 2689 02:06:27,650 --> 02:06:23,480 teeter-totter over toward Z the more 2690 02:06:30,170 --> 02:06:27,660 from lays a fair hands off abductions to 2691 02:06:32,660 --> 02:06:30,180 positive abductions and benevolent space 2692 02:06:35,360 --> 02:06:32,670 brother types going kind of harkening 2693 02:06:38,510 --> 02:06:35,370 back to the contact these are you seeing 2694 02:06:40,790 --> 02:06:38,520 that there's a shift going on here that 2695 02:06:44,000 --> 02:06:40,800 more people who are into the abduction 2696 02:06:45,620 --> 02:06:44,010 mystery are leaning now away from the 2697 02:06:49,510 --> 02:06:45,630 negative side towards the positive side 2698 02:06:54,050 --> 02:06:49,520 I am seeing a shift in the popular media 2699 02:06:56,990 --> 02:06:54,060 in the topics being presented at 2700 02:07:00,380 --> 02:06:57,000 conferences there does seem to be a 2701 02:07:03,380 --> 02:07:00,390 movement among people who would like to 2702 02:07:05,420 --> 02:07:03,390 say that all of this is very positive 2703 02:07:09,440 --> 02:07:05,430 that they're here for the benefit of 2704 02:07:13,010 --> 02:07:09,450 humanity just like occurred back in 1952 2705 02:07:16,340 --> 02:07:13,020 but that is not consistent with the 2706 02:07:20,330 --> 02:07:16,350 reports that we receive at the mutual 2707 02:07:25,220 --> 02:07:20,340 UFO network where the majority of people 2708 02:07:28,160 --> 02:07:25,230 are still saying that they believe that 2709 02:07:31,960 --> 02:07:28,170 their experiences are both positive and 2710 02:07:33,890 --> 02:07:31,970 negative that they've been taken by 2711 02:07:37,820 --> 02:07:33,900 individuals who seem to have the 2712 02:07:41,210 --> 02:07:37,830 scientific interest in them many of 2713 02:07:46,160 --> 02:07:41,220 these individuals are not being treated 2714 02:07:49,790 --> 02:07:46,170 as equals and are not feeling that they 2715 02:07:54,590 --> 02:07:49,800 are highly valued at SEP for the value 2716 02:07:58,240 --> 02:07:54,600 they have to these nonhumans who are 2717 02:08:01,070 --> 02:07:58,250 taken them at the same time we have 2718 02:08:04,700 --> 02:08:01,080 about 10 percent who believe that 2719 02:08:08,360 --> 02:08:04,710 they're being contacted by beings that 2720 02:08:11,180 --> 02:08:08,370 are just outright evil and I'm wondering 2721 02:08:14,750 --> 02:08:11,190 if these are interdimensional sorts and 2722 02:08:18,950 --> 02:08:14,760 not the space people coming here as 2723 02:08:22,520 --> 02:08:18,960 astronauts or scientists but when we do 2724 02:08:25,610 --> 02:08:22,530 ask people if they would like for it to 2725 02:08:29,300 --> 02:08:25,620 end if they could end it today would 2726 02:08:32,480 --> 02:08:29,310 they the majority say they would 2727 02:08:37,190 --> 02:08:32,490 which is I think very interesting as 2728 02:08:42,140 --> 02:08:37,200 well only about 30% would like to end 2729 02:08:44,720 --> 02:08:42,150 this process and overall it seems when 2730 02:08:48,650 --> 02:08:44,730 when they can stand back and reflect 2731 02:08:53,000 --> 02:08:48,660 upon their experiences they do not feel 2732 02:08:54,950 --> 02:08:53,010 that they were harmed in general they do 2733 02:08:58,730 --> 02:08:54,960 feel that this might have been 2734 02:09:03,460 --> 02:08:58,740 beneficial in some way so it's really 2735 02:09:07,010 --> 02:09:03,470 difficult to peg down MUFON is currently 2736 02:09:10,610 --> 02:09:07,020 doing another commonality study a 2737 02:09:14,630 --> 02:09:10,620 research project we have over 300 2738 02:09:17,360 --> 02:09:14,640 participants I think that probably our 2739 02:09:20,810 --> 02:09:17,370 study will be completed in another year 2740 02:09:23,840 --> 02:09:20,820 so we'll know more than in terms of 2741 02:09:25,510 --> 02:09:23,850 statistical evidence now I do know that 2742 02:09:28,460 --> 02:09:25,520 the foundation for research into 2743 02:09:32,560 --> 02:09:28,470 extraterrestrial encounters has just 2744 02:09:37,430 --> 02:09:32,570 completed a survey and they had over 2745 02:09:42,740 --> 02:09:37,440 3,000 participants and of those 3,000 2746 02:09:46,760 --> 02:09:42,750 about 75% I believe stated that they 2747 02:09:55,820 --> 02:09:46,770 viewed their encounters in a positive 2748 02:09:59,030 --> 02:09:55,830 light Wow well I guess yeah why I'm 2749 02:10:01,700 --> 02:09:59,040 thinking that possibly this the sort of 2750 02:10:03,710 --> 02:10:01,710 media treatment of the subject is act is 2751 02:10:07,010 --> 02:10:03,720 seems to have be accurately reflecting 2752 02:10:09,560 --> 02:10:07,020 the what you're calling for senator just 2753 02:10:11,090 --> 02:10:09,570 some in 3,000 cases 75 percent saying 2754 02:10:14,750 --> 02:10:11,100 that these that they feel that these are 2755 02:10:17,420 --> 02:10:14,760 are not negative events let's put it 2756 02:10:19,580 --> 02:10:17,430 that way we got more to come a couple 2757 02:10:21,680 --> 02:10:19,590 more segments about fact fiction flying 2758 02:10:24,500 --> 02:10:21,690 saucers with Stanton Friedman Cathleen 2759 02:10:26,580 --> 02:10:24,510 Martin and Chris and Jean you're in a 2760 02:10:37,260 --> 02:10:26,590 parry cast 2761 02:10:42,290 --> 02:10:37,270 [Music] 2762 02:10:49,879 --> 02:10:48,260 visit GP and live.com today this is dan 2763 02:10:52,100 --> 02:10:49,889 pilla do you owe the IRS money you can't 2764 02:10:54,080 --> 02:10:52,110 pay our tax debts crippling you I've 2765 02:10:56,120 --> 02:10:54,090 defended people from the IRS for over 30 2766 02:10:58,220 --> 02:10:56,130 years I've helped thousands and I can 2767 02:10:59,689 --> 02:10:58,230 help you too I wrote the book on IRS 2768 02:11:01,899 --> 02:10:59,699 settlement and I'm telling you there's 2769 02:11:05,089 --> 02:11:01,909 no such thing as a hopeless case call 2770 02:11:06,830 --> 02:11:05,099 834 no tax to finally get free of IRS 2771 02:11:08,209 --> 02:11:06,840 debt with the IRS as new programs 2772 02:11:11,030 --> 02:11:08,219 there's never been a better time to 2773 02:11:14,839 --> 02:11:11,040 solve your problem call 834 no tax 2774 02:11:17,569 --> 02:11:14,849 that's 803 for no tax or my website Dan 2775 02:11:18,859 --> 02:11:17,579 pillow calm feet military spokesperson 2776 02:11:20,000 --> 02:11:18,869 Adam Pulaski of the valetti law firm 2777 02:11:20,899 --> 02:11:20,010 with visible often use detect assist the 2778 02:11:22,069 --> 02:11:20,909 attorney Merce muscle for the content of 2779 02:11:23,240 --> 02:11:22,079 this ad is not legal advice in the 2780 02:11:24,049 --> 02:11:23,250 choice of inertia double bass only valid 2781 02:11:25,669 --> 02:11:24,059 for judgment services may not be 2782 02:11:27,290 --> 02:11:25,679 available no States attentions rlto 2783 02:11:29,089 --> 02:11:27,300 users if you are a loved one took 2784 02:11:30,649 --> 02:11:29,099 Xarelto and suffered a serious bleeding 2785 02:11:31,580 --> 02:11:30,659 event you may be entitled to financial 2786 02:11:33,470 --> 02:11:31,590 compensation 2787 02:11:35,060 --> 02:11:33,480 Xarelto is a popular prescription blood 2788 02:11:36,439 --> 02:11:35,070 thinner used to prevent blood clots and 2789 02:11:37,669 --> 02:11:36,449 protect patients from strokes the 2790 02:11:39,379 --> 02:11:37,679 serious bleeding events have led to 2791 02:11:41,450 --> 02:11:39,389 numerous cases of hospitalization and 2792 02:11:43,790 --> 02:11:41,460 even death phone lines are open 24/7 2793 02:11:45,830 --> 02:11:43,800 call 802 six one zero nine three seven 2794 02:11:50,959 --> 02:11:45,840 that's 800 two six one zero nine three 2795 02:11:53,510 --> 02:11:50,969 seven this is a health care alert from 2796 02:11:55,220 --> 02:11:53,520 the pain relief hotline if you a family 2797 02:11:57,229 --> 02:11:55,230 member or a loved one suffered from knee 2798 02:11:59,149 --> 02:11:57,239 back shoulder or ankle pain and have 2799 02:12:01,129 --> 02:11:59,159 Medicare as your primary insurance we've 2800 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02:13:31,570 share their experiences about the 2842 02:13:35,670 --> 02:13:33,580 paranormal the unexplainable for the 2843 02:13:37,500 --> 02:13:35,680 afterlife and so much more and this is 2844 02:13:40,050 --> 02:13:37,510 the source for them to meet and share 2845 02:13:41,510 --> 02:13:40,060 that common interest Society for free at 2846 02:13:44,580 --> 02:13:41,520 paranormal date.com 2847 02:13:46,830 --> 02:13:44,590 paranormal date calm and use the code 2848 02:13:48,990 --> 02:13:46,840 George if you decide to connect with 2849 02:13:50,820 --> 02:13:49,000 someone you like are you happy washing 2850 02:13:52,830 --> 02:13:50,830 your hands with harsh chemicals are you 2851 02:13:55,200 --> 02:13:52,840 happy doing laundry with detergents are 2852 02:13:56,940 --> 02:13:55,210 you happy paying high prices find your 2853 02:13:59,220 --> 02:13:56,950 happiness with pure soap these 2854 02:14:01,830 --> 02:13:59,230 all-natural earth friendly pure soaps 2855 02:14:04,890 --> 02:14:01,840 are the very best you've ever used buy 2856 02:14:07,560 --> 02:14:04,900 in bulk get a 12 36 or 48 month's supply 2857 02:14:09,660 --> 02:14:07,570 or get items individually and still save 2858 02:14:11,550 --> 02:14:09,670 big you're getting soap products twice 2859 02:14:14,340 --> 02:14:11,560 as good as what you're using now earth 2860 02:14:15,360 --> 02:14:14,350 friendly and natural soaps your family 2861 02:14:18,510 --> 02:14:15,370 deserves the best 2862 02:14:20,460 --> 02:14:18,520 happiness is five-star soap calm why not 2863 02:14:23,460 --> 02:14:20,470 put your money up the drain for a change 2864 02:14:26,040 --> 02:14:23,470 see them at five star soap calm or call 2865 02:14:27,990 --> 02:14:26,050 1-800 three four zero seven zero nine 2866 02:14:29,640 --> 02:14:28,000 one four a catalog Cal Ben's soap 2867 02:14:31,740 --> 02:14:29,650 company can save you thousands of 2868 02:14:34,260 --> 02:14:31,750 dollars and give you good old-fashioned 2869 02:14:36,300 --> 02:14:34,270 real soaps that are triple concentrated 2870 02:14:38,550 --> 02:14:36,310 soaps made from vegetable and coconut 2871 02:14:40,560 --> 02:14:38,560 oils see their full selection of soaps 2872 02:14:43,680 --> 02:14:40,570 at five star soap calm 2873 02:14:46,110 --> 02:14:43,690 that's FIV e star soap calm we'll call 2874 02:14:49,540 --> 02:14:46,120 1-800 three four zero seven zero nine 2875 02:14:57,229 --> 02:14:54,979 [Music] 2876 02:14:59,209 --> 02:14:57,239 hi this is Bryce label I'm the producer 2877 02:15:01,129 --> 02:14:59,219 of dark skies the co-author of AD after 2878 02:15:03,279 --> 02:15:01,139 disclosure and you are listening to the 2879 02:15:05,680 --> 02:15:03,289 para cast the gold standard of 2880 02:15:12,720 --> 02:15:05,690 paranormal radio 2881 02:15:15,549 --> 02:15:12,730 [Music] 2882 02:15:18,790 --> 02:15:15,559 we're back for couple more segments this 2883 02:15:21,040 --> 02:15:18,800 is a such a fascinating subject that 2884 02:15:23,379 --> 02:15:21,050 we're not going to finish anything here 2885 02:15:25,899 --> 02:15:23,389 but maybe we can have a future 2886 02:15:28,540 --> 02:15:25,909 discussion brings Stanton and Kathleen 2887 02:15:30,850 --> 02:15:28,550 back for more Chris here's a question 2888 02:15:33,640 --> 02:15:30,860 from Han who's been a longtime poster at 2889 02:15:35,109 --> 02:15:33,650 forum dr. Peric ascom where our 2890 02:15:38,830 --> 02:15:35,119 listeners get a chance to ask questions 2891 02:15:40,270 --> 02:15:38,840 of our guests this one I'm pretty 2892 02:15:43,000 --> 02:15:40,280 interested to hear the answer to this 2893 02:15:45,220 --> 02:15:43,010 but Stanton to your knowledge has the 2894 02:15:48,879 --> 02:15:45,230 u.s. or any other government formed a 2895 02:15:51,879 --> 02:15:48,889 military unit with its sole purpose or 2896 02:15:55,750 --> 02:15:51,889 one of its purposes or tasks to attempt 2897 02:15:57,910 --> 02:15:55,760 to shoot down glory interceptor UFO well 2898 02:16:03,160 --> 02:15:57,920 that's an interesting question because 2899 02:16:05,740 --> 02:16:03,170 way back in 1952 the orders went out if 2900 02:16:08,290 --> 02:16:05,750 they don't land when instructed to do so 2901 02:16:10,390 --> 02:16:08,300 shoot them down and we have newspaper 2902 02:16:12,069 --> 02:16:10,400 articles proving that although the story 2903 02:16:14,589 --> 02:16:12,079 wasn't covered by the Washington Post to 2904 02:16:16,330 --> 02:16:14,599 the New York Times but we have official 2905 02:16:18,370 --> 02:16:16,340 air force spokesman stating that and 2906 02:16:19,390 --> 02:16:18,380 General Roger Ramey was involved the 2907 02:16:21,189 --> 02:16:19,400 Roswell Raymie 2908 02:16:24,390 --> 02:16:21,199 I don't know that he would have wanted 2909 02:16:28,629 --> 02:16:24,400 to be called that but oh we've scrambled 2910 02:16:30,790 --> 02:16:28,639 hundreds of times just routine but it 2911 02:16:33,519 --> 02:16:30,800 was clear that there was a procedure 2912 02:16:35,589 --> 02:16:33,529 being carried out to try to do something 2913 02:16:37,690 --> 02:16:35,599 you shoot them down if they don't land 2914 02:16:39,730 --> 02:16:37,700 when instructed to do so that means that 2915 02:16:43,679 --> 02:16:39,740 they're we're trying to get them to land 2916 02:16:45,940 --> 02:16:43,689 for what purpose you know so I think 2917 02:16:49,209 --> 02:16:45,950 somebody would have come to terms with 2918 02:16:52,179 --> 02:16:49,219 the fact that the aliens have far better 2919 02:16:53,950 --> 02:16:52,189 technology than we do and the stories 2920 02:16:57,129 --> 02:16:53,960 that I've heard I've heard seven cases 2921 02:17:00,099 --> 02:16:57,139 now firsthand from people who were at 2922 02:17:02,559 --> 02:17:00,109 bases military bases saying that as a 2923 02:17:05,190 --> 02:17:02,569 saucer was a plane was scrambled to 2924 02:17:08,110 --> 02:17:05,200 chase a saucer and never came back 2925 02:17:12,280 --> 02:17:08,120 this is back most of the many years ago 2926 02:17:14,290 --> 02:17:12,290 and so the cases I've seen where they 2927 02:17:19,059 --> 02:17:14,300 seem to have done damage I'm thinking of 2928 02:17:21,290 --> 02:17:19,069 the Cuban mid case where saucer is 2929 02:17:23,750 --> 02:17:21,300 coming heading toward Cuba like the 2930 02:17:26,330 --> 02:17:23,760 up on radar we have listening-posts are 2931 02:17:30,200 --> 02:17:26,340 picking this up over the airwaves and 2932 02:17:32,870 --> 02:17:30,210 the Cubans of Russians scramble two Jets 2933 02:17:34,639 --> 02:17:32,880 two MiG's go after it tell them like 2934 02:17:36,709 --> 02:17:34,649 that back out of our territory nothing 2935 02:17:38,270 --> 02:17:36,719 happened so what should we do they asked 2936 02:17:41,809 --> 02:17:38,280 the ground the ground says shoot them 2937 02:17:46,520 --> 02:17:41,819 down so the lead pilot is missile is 2938 02:17:48,320 --> 02:17:46,530 armed his radar lock on and then they're 2939 02:17:51,559 --> 02:17:48,330 screaming over the airwaves from the 2940 02:17:53,870 --> 02:17:51,569 second pilot no wingmen if you will st. 2941 02:17:55,790 --> 02:17:53,880 the first plane Justice integrated well 2942 02:17:57,559 --> 02:17:55,800 somebody had to make a decision if 2943 02:18:00,620 --> 02:17:57,569 somebody's got a missile aimed at you 2944 02:18:03,440 --> 02:18:00,630 and you can tell he's got a lock on you 2945 02:18:06,500 --> 02:18:03,450 got to do something and so I think they 2946 02:18:10,610 --> 02:18:06,510 responded in a very sensible kind of way 2947 02:18:14,690 --> 02:18:10,620 self-defense acceptable argument in law 2948 02:18:18,559 --> 02:18:14,700 isn't it you know for good evil things 2949 02:18:21,379 --> 02:18:18,569 if you will so I think that there are 2950 02:18:24,849 --> 02:18:21,389 procedures but I think that somehow 2951 02:18:27,849 --> 02:18:24,859 along the way somebody said hey yeah 2952 02:18:30,500 --> 02:18:27,859 these guys are better than we are and 2953 02:18:33,770 --> 02:18:30,510 let's leave them alone we won't shoot at 2954 02:18:35,719 --> 02:18:33,780 them and they won't shoot at us along 2955 02:18:38,809 --> 02:18:35,729 those lines I mean you mentioned needs 2956 02:18:41,509 --> 02:18:38,819 in obvious advanced levels of technology 2957 02:18:43,459 --> 02:18:41,519 we have a question here from in and this 2958 02:18:45,950 --> 02:18:43,469 is one of my favorite avatar names on 2959 02:18:49,509 --> 02:18:45,960 the on the forums here Greer's meeting 2960 02:18:55,099 --> 02:18:51,799 so we're talking about exalted 2961 02:18:57,469 --> 02:18:55,109 technology but you know he whoever this 2962 02:18:59,839 --> 02:18:57,479 is then regarding your hypothesis that 2963 02:19:02,179 --> 02:18:59,849 simple radar could have been responsible 2964 02:19:03,860 --> 02:19:02,189 for causing the Roswell crash I have 2965 02:19:05,360 --> 02:19:03,870 heard in previous interviews you suggest 2966 02:19:07,459 --> 02:19:05,370 that the alien ships navigation or 2967 02:19:09,740 --> 02:19:07,469 operation may have been taken by 2968 02:19:12,410 --> 02:19:09,750 surprise by the radar radio waves 2969 02:19:14,150 --> 02:19:12,420 causing it to catastrophic we fail to 2970 02:19:16,219 --> 02:19:14,160 the fullness of crash and he says 2971 02:19:17,990 --> 02:19:16,229 considering this can you please explain 2972 02:19:20,150 --> 02:19:18,000 your hypothesis in some sort of 2973 02:19:22,370 --> 02:19:20,160 technical detail using your your 2974 02:19:23,990 --> 02:19:22,380 scientific background and if radio waves 2975 02:19:25,520 --> 02:19:24,000 caused alien navigation propulsion 2976 02:19:28,879 --> 02:19:25,530 systems to fail 2977 02:19:32,089 --> 02:19:28,889 can we shortcut what the technology is 2978 02:19:33,820 --> 02:19:32,099 being used by these craft if something 2979 02:19:37,030 --> 02:19:33,830 like radio waves can bring them down 2980 02:19:39,040 --> 02:19:37,040 and kind of a third question have you 2981 02:19:41,620 --> 02:19:39,050 ever had any doubts about that theory of 2982 02:19:44,290 --> 02:19:41,630 radar bringing the craft down and if so 2983 02:19:46,959 --> 02:19:44,300 has that theory or have your thoughts 2984 02:19:49,090 --> 02:19:46,969 about this changed over time I never 2985 02:19:53,920 --> 02:19:49,100 said the radar brought the craft down 2986 02:19:56,770 --> 02:19:53,930 I'm saying - UFO is flying along they 2987 02:19:58,240 --> 02:19:56,780 run into a radar beam over New Mexico 2988 02:19:59,830 --> 02:19:58,250 there weren't many places where you'd 2989 02:20:02,740 --> 02:19:59,840 run into the beam but there was a rocket 2990 02:20:05,790 --> 02:20:02,750 scheduled for launch that means the beam 2991 02:20:08,349 --> 02:20:05,800 is just not going around this is not 2992 02:20:10,480 --> 02:20:08,359 circular radar like we like to think you 2993 02:20:11,530 --> 02:20:10,490 know the beam goes around and pick up 2994 02:20:13,300 --> 02:20:11,540 stuff going through there 2995 02:20:16,270 --> 02:20:13,310 it's just taming a beam right on out 2996 02:20:20,320 --> 02:20:16,280 there and the reason being that we used 2997 02:20:21,760 --> 02:20:20,330 back into radars back in 1947 so you 2998 02:20:24,190 --> 02:20:21,770 leave them on because otherwise you got 2999 02:20:26,440 --> 02:20:24,200 to warm them up and so I'm not saying it 3000 02:20:30,360 --> 02:20:26,450 brought it down at all I'm saying there 3001 02:20:34,990 --> 02:20:30,370 was a glitch maybe two saucers 3002 02:20:38,410 --> 02:20:35,000 temporarily the radar navigated the 3003 02:20:41,770 --> 02:20:38,420 navigation system or their propulsion 3004 02:20:44,380 --> 02:20:41,780 system just a tiny you know there's a 3005 02:20:47,290 --> 02:20:44,390 puddle in a road kind of thing I didn't 3006 02:20:50,950 --> 02:20:47,300 say it brought it down and I think that 3007 02:20:55,570 --> 02:20:50,960 we expect surprises always to be part of 3008 02:20:57,580 --> 02:20:55,580 what goes on the unexpected will happen 3009 02:21:01,389 --> 02:20:57,590 sometimes it's good sometimes it's bad 3010 02:21:03,250 --> 02:21:01,399 you've got to be ready to respond so I'm 3011 02:21:06,090 --> 02:21:03,260 not saying that when they hit a radar 3012 02:21:09,700 --> 02:21:06,100 beam they're destroyed or anything like 3013 02:21:12,309 --> 02:21:09,710 he's asking about them being responsible 3014 02:21:13,660 --> 02:21:12,319 for causing the Roswell crash he's not 3015 02:21:16,809 --> 02:21:13,670 he's not suggesting that they were 3016 02:21:19,809 --> 02:21:16,819 brought down or that you suggest that no 3017 02:21:22,780 --> 02:21:19,819 I certainly didn't suggest that I it 3018 02:21:24,400 --> 02:21:22,790 strikes me because we've got two crafts 3019 02:21:28,090 --> 02:21:24,410 coming down one on the plains of San 3020 02:21:31,090 --> 02:21:28,100 Agustin and one over in Corona I asked a 3021 02:21:34,150 --> 02:21:31,100 former general who was a pilot if you 3022 02:21:36,460 --> 02:21:34,160 have a mid-air collision is the damage 3023 02:21:39,099 --> 02:21:36,470 symmetric that is the same to both craft 3024 02:21:42,070 --> 02:21:39,109 he said almost never one makes it one 3025 02:21:44,980 --> 02:21:42,080 doesn't that's the way things go so if 3026 02:21:46,260 --> 02:21:44,990 he had a temporary I'll call it a 3027 02:21:49,560 --> 02:21:46,270 collision and 3028 02:21:52,020 --> 02:21:49,570 in quotes one may have gone that way and 3029 02:21:53,760 --> 02:21:52,030 the other one went down here and my 3030 02:21:55,980 --> 02:21:53,770 first conversation was dressing Marcel 3031 02:21:59,730 --> 02:21:55,990 he said there feels there had to have 3032 02:22:02,460 --> 02:21:59,740 been a mid-air explosion because of how 3033 02:22:05,520 --> 02:22:02,470 widely the wreckage was distributed and 3034 02:22:09,030 --> 02:22:05,530 because there was no crater makes sense 3035 02:22:14,190 --> 02:22:09,040 to me so one goes that way one goes on 3036 02:22:16,830 --> 02:22:14,200 unfortunately one made it so we don't 3037 02:22:19,080 --> 02:22:16,840 have to assume it's anything we do know 3038 02:22:22,920 --> 02:22:19,090 you're right we don't have to assume 3039 02:22:27,469 --> 02:22:22,930 it's anything we did misfortune you know 3040 02:22:32,400 --> 02:22:29,640 nobody was trying to get thingy 3041 02:22:35,430 --> 02:22:32,410 that's why et is like us they used the 3042 02:22:38,760 --> 02:22:35,440 lowest bidder for their spaceships and 3043 02:22:42,000 --> 02:22:38,770 sometimes things just go wrong all those 3044 02:22:45,900 --> 02:22:42,010 cost overruns shuttles remember remember 3045 02:22:48,180 --> 02:22:45,910 two shuttles we lost yeah and there are 3046 02:22:49,800 --> 02:22:48,190 other accidents that have Bennet you 3047 02:22:51,450 --> 02:22:49,810 know when I say accident that covers a 3048 02:22:53,850 --> 02:22:51,460 lot of ground the discovery of 3049 02:22:56,130 --> 02:22:53,860 penicillin was an accident 3050 02:22:59,310 --> 02:22:56,140 totally discovery of x-rays was an 3051 02:23:01,980 --> 02:22:59,320 accident that is unplanned but somebody 3052 02:23:05,130 --> 02:23:01,990 was there to observe and say hmm that's 3053 02:23:07,770 --> 02:23:05,140 interesting let's check this out so I 3054 02:23:10,080 --> 02:23:07,780 have to allow for the unexpected and I'm 3055 02:23:12,090 --> 02:23:10,090 not saying aliens are perfect but I'm 3056 02:23:13,920 --> 02:23:12,100 certainly not saying that the radar 3057 02:23:18,870 --> 02:23:13,930 brought them down or anything like that 3058 02:23:20,610 --> 02:23:18,880 it was unfortunate situation that we 3059 02:23:22,140 --> 02:23:20,620 have another question here that's very 3060 02:23:24,990 --> 02:23:22,150 interesting I've never really thought 3061 02:23:27,330 --> 02:23:25,000 about this I think it's showing some 3062 02:23:29,880 --> 02:23:27,340 creative thinking by Williams craftsmen 3063 02:23:32,640 --> 02:23:29,890 who again is about poster at forum dr. 3064 02:23:34,410 --> 02:23:32,650 Peric ascom and he goes on the premise 3065 02:23:35,010 --> 02:23:34,420 that aliens have been interacting with 3066 02:23:37,140 --> 02:23:35,020 humans 3067 02:23:40,080 --> 02:23:37,150 I wondered if either of you were aware 3068 02:23:41,910 --> 02:23:40,090 of anyone who suggests that aliens may 3069 02:23:44,370 --> 02:23:41,920 be playing both sides of the UFO 3070 02:23:46,710 --> 02:23:44,380 controversy what it means by that is a 3071 02:23:48,330 --> 02:23:46,720 aliens interact with experiences and 3072 02:23:50,940 --> 02:23:48,340 ways to convince them of some kind of 3073 02:23:53,180 --> 02:23:50,950 direct contact and the aliens act on 3074 02:23:55,770 --> 02:23:53,190 skeptics to intensify their skepticism 3075 02:23:58,870 --> 02:23:55,780 with subliminal influence that is not 3076 02:24:01,360 --> 02:23:58,880 detected as contact per se in other word 3077 02:24:03,880 --> 02:24:01,370 much of the controversy is facilitated 3078 02:24:06,160 --> 02:24:03,890 by the aliens themselves keeping the UFO 3079 02:24:14,710 --> 02:24:06,170 topic nice and murky and keeping humans 3080 02:24:17,139 --> 02:24:14,720 in perpetual conflict it kind of has a 3081 02:24:19,679 --> 02:24:17,149 ring to it doesn't it before we have the 3082 02:24:23,290 --> 02:24:19,689 ring go astray we need to do our break 3083 02:24:26,370 --> 02:24:23,300 Jean and Chris Stanton and Kathleen 3084 02:24:37,940 --> 02:24:26,380 you're in the para cast 3085 02:24:46,350 --> 02:24:42,720 thank you for listening to GCS visit GC 3086 02:24:52,900 --> 02:24:49,600 we also have swag you know we have all 3087 02:24:55,450 --> 02:24:52,910 these exclusive power cast things that 3088 02:24:58,480 --> 02:24:55,460 you can buy we've got like I guess 60 or 3089 02:25:02,080 --> 02:24:58,490 so different items and entails t-shirts 3090 02:25:05,380 --> 02:25:02,090 sleeves for notebook computers iPad 3091 02:25:07,690 --> 02:25:05,390 cases mouse pads the para cast jumbo 3092 02:25:09,551 --> 02:25:07,700 tote bag all sorts of t-shirts and 3093 02:25:12,790 --> 02:25:09,561 jackets and stuff like that for men and 3094 02:25:15,670 --> 02:25:12,800 women we have a para cast aluminum water 3095 02:25:18,580 --> 02:25:15,680 bottle all the stuff you go to store the 3096 02:25:19,390 --> 02:25:18,590 power cast com stored dot the power cast 3097 02:25:22,120 --> 02:25:19,400 com 3098 02:25:24,370 --> 02:25:22,130 what makes special is that the items are 3099 02:25:26,950 --> 02:25:24,380 the best quality of great t-shirts 3100 02:25:28,330 --> 02:25:26,960 fabrics and they have our official logo 3101 02:25:31,240 --> 02:25:28,340 on them that's what makes them special 3102 02:25:33,970 --> 02:25:31,250 multiple sizes and colors we even have 3103 02:25:36,220 --> 02:25:33,980 stuff for children stuff for women's 3104 02:25:38,890 --> 02:25:36,230 stuff for men we have all sorts of sizes 3105 02:25:41,290 --> 02:25:38,900 like small up 2x large a lot of good 3106 02:25:44,950 --> 02:25:41,300 stuff that's the swag from the para cast 3107 02:25:47,440 --> 02:25:44,960 you go to steward dot ^ cast com stop by 3108 02:25:49,180 --> 02:25:47,450 and take a shopping tour are the answers 3109 02:25:51,220 --> 02:25:49,190 to your present and future hidden in 3110 02:25:52,841 --> 02:25:51,230 your past akashic readings help you 3111 02:25:54,990 --> 02:25:52,851 learn to unlock the answers for love 3112 02:25:57,400 --> 02:25:55,000 finances weight loss self-esteem 3113 02:25:59,530 --> 02:25:57,410 confusion grief and loss and more 3114 02:26:01,960 --> 02:25:59,540 akashic email readings by dr. kelly 3115 02:26:04,150 --> 02:26:01,970 maroon PhD our specially priced right 3116 02:26:06,850 --> 02:26:04,160 now learn more at dr. kelly Maroons 3117 02:26:10,600 --> 02:26:06,860 website Akashic universal comm spelled 3118 02:26:12,490 --> 02:26:10,610 aka Shi C universal comm change your 3119 02:26:14,320 --> 02:26:12,500 life today become one with your true 3120 02:26:17,320 --> 02:26:14,330 path with intention on purpose 3121 02:26:19,390 --> 02:26:17,330 visit Akashic Universal calm looking for 3122 02:26:21,640 --> 02:26:19,400 that edge during those 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out by calling now for a 3151 02:27:25,769 --> 02:27:24,279 free trial of new biotics the new 3152 02:27:28,170 --> 02:27:25,779 breakthrough that flattens bloated 3153 02:27:30,120 --> 02:27:28,180 bellies fast for a free trial call one 3154 02:27:32,010 --> 02:27:30,130 eight hundred nine nine zero one two 3155 02:27:33,719 --> 02:27:32,020 four three strict limit of one per 3156 02:27:36,210 --> 02:27:33,729 household I used to be plagued by 3157 02:27:38,279 --> 02:27:36,220 potbelly and constant bloating after 3158 02:27:40,349 --> 02:27:38,289 taking new biotics my belly flattened 3159 02:27:41,969 --> 02:27:40,359 and continues to get flatter my sense of 3160 02:27:43,979 --> 02:27:41,979 bloating and discomfort is gone if 3161 02:27:46,019 --> 02:27:43,989 you've got a big belly you might not be 3162 02:27:47,550 --> 02:27:46,029 fat you might just be bloated new 3163 02:27:49,590 --> 02:27:47,560 biotics is scientifically formulated 3164 02:27:51,750 --> 02:27:49,600 with natural ingredients to flatten 3165 02:27:53,550 --> 02:27:51,760 bloated bellies fast by cleansing pounds 3166 02:27:55,529 --> 02:27:53,560 of rotting food and toxic sludge from 3167 02:27:57,630 --> 02:27:55,539 your body it even combats periodic 3168 02:27:59,309 --> 02:27:57,640 heartburn and acid reflux if your belly 3169 02:28:01,080 --> 02:27:59,319 flattening results are too dramatic 3170 02:28:03,179 --> 02:28:01,090 simply reduce use to every other day 3171 02:28:05,250 --> 02:28:03,189 think you might be bloated see how much 3172 02:28:07,050 --> 02:28:05,260 flatter new biotics makes your belly but 3173 02:28:08,790 --> 02:28:07,060 hurry call now for details while we're 3174 02:28:11,040 --> 02:28:08,800 still giving it away for free one eight 3175 02:28:12,750 --> 02:28:11,050 hundred nine nine zero one two four 3176 02:28:14,969 --> 02:28:12,760 three that's one eight hundred nine nine 3177 02:28:17,250 --> 02:28:14,979 zero one two four three one eight 3178 02:28:19,649 --> 02:28:17,260 hundred nine nine zero one two four 3179 02:28:21,689 --> 02:28:19,659 three fully cooked ready to eat bacon 3180 02:28:23,910 --> 02:28:21,699 I'm talking thick meaty center-cut 3181 02:28:26,989 --> 02:28:23,920 presidential bacon savory and delicious 3182 02:28:29,729 --> 02:28:26,999 I buy some I use some I store some 3183 02:28:31,019 --> 02:28:29,739 awesome no refrigeration needed with a 3184 02:28:34,139 --> 02:28:31,029 10 year shelf-life 3185 02:28:36,540 --> 02:28:34,149 NASA pack technology bacon fully cooked 3186 02:28:38,840 --> 02:28:36,550 fully hydrated ready-to-eat right from 3187 02:28:41,700 --> 02:28:38,850 the pack bacon or warm and served 3188 02:28:44,370 --> 02:28:41,710 life-saving ready to eat bacon 10 year 3189 02:28:46,620 --> 02:28:44,380 shelf-life bacon ships free at fully 3190 02:28:49,500 --> 02:28:46,630 cooked bacon calm fully cooked bacon 3191 02:28:49,510 --> 02:28:53,620 [Music] 3192 02:28:57,620 --> 02:28:55,700 this is Micah hang to the graylien 3193 02:28:59,690 --> 02:28:57,630 report and you're listening to the para 3194 02:29:00,400 --> 02:28:59,700 cast the gold standard of paranormal 3195 02:29:08,199 --> 02:29:00,410 radio 3196 02:29:11,149 --> 02:29:08,209 [Music] 3197 02:29:13,969 --> 02:29:11,159 you know Chris that's got rank is one of 3198 02:29:16,300 --> 02:29:13,979 the most fascinating if offbeat 3199 02:29:19,969 --> 02:29:16,310 questions we've ever had in the 3200 02:29:22,460 --> 02:29:19,979 Transformers yeah the aliens are doing 3201 02:29:24,979 --> 02:29:22,470 it the conspiracy man are not 3202 02:29:27,849 --> 02:29:24,989 Confederacy con man they aren't even men 3203 02:29:30,949 --> 02:29:27,859 or women they are aliens doing it to us 3204 02:29:33,319 --> 02:29:30,959 well you know you have to remember there 3205 02:29:35,359 --> 02:29:33,329 may be aliens coming here from many 3206 02:29:38,719 --> 02:29:35,369 different places and for many different 3207 02:29:40,729 --> 02:29:38,729 purposes I think back to post Columbus 3208 02:29:44,529 --> 02:29:40,739 there were guys who came to the new 3209 02:29:47,439 --> 02:29:44,539 world to save the souls of the natives 3210 02:29:49,909 --> 02:29:47,449 others who wanted to steal their gold 3211 02:29:54,529 --> 02:29:49,919 others who brought back vegetables after 3212 02:29:57,889 --> 02:29:54,539 ah that's why here ET wants to get some 3213 02:30:00,170 --> 02:29:57,899 of these earth potatoes Idaho potatoes 3214 02:30:03,050 --> 02:30:00,180 that's what they're after well remember 3215 02:30:04,639 --> 02:30:03,060 too that the earth is the densest planet 3216 02:30:05,960 --> 02:30:04,649 in the solar system 3217 02:30:10,069 --> 02:30:05,970 I mean the people although you probably 3218 02:30:12,260 --> 02:30:10,079 you guys would probably say the people I 3219 02:30:13,639 --> 02:30:12,270 meant the cubic foot of Earth weighs 3220 02:30:15,920 --> 02:30:13,649 more than a cubic foot of any other 3221 02:30:17,359 --> 02:30:15,930 planet and you say so what well that 3222 02:30:19,489 --> 02:30:17,369 means you're a lot of heavy metals here 3223 02:30:22,269 --> 02:30:19,499 and there aren't in the universe we know 3224 02:30:25,250 --> 02:30:22,279 from studying those spectra from stars 3225 02:30:28,099 --> 02:30:25,260 that heavy metals are rare but they have 3226 02:30:32,000 --> 02:30:28,109 special properties things like osmium 3227 02:30:34,849 --> 02:30:32,010 and rhenium and iridium osmium is twice 3228 02:30:36,649 --> 02:30:34,859 as dense as lead for anybody who wants 3229 02:30:39,649 --> 02:30:36,659 something peculiar to say it the next 3230 02:30:41,989 --> 02:30:39,659 drinkin party I got the answer Stan the 3231 02:30:46,010 --> 02:30:41,999 Ferengi are here to get Earth's gold 3232 02:30:48,109 --> 02:30:46,020 well or fertilize me a murder iridium or 3233 02:30:49,279 --> 02:30:48,119 rhenium one of my favorite metals for 3234 02:30:51,229 --> 02:30:49,289 some reason or other 3235 02:30:54,139 --> 02:30:51,239 who knows maybe they've been mining our 3236 02:30:55,670 --> 02:30:54,149 resources for a very long time how many 3237 02:30:57,559 --> 02:30:55,680 places can you go and pick up some 3238 02:31:01,609 --> 02:30:57,569 rhenium or some rare earths or some 3239 02:31:03,529 --> 02:31:01,619 whatever and you know we are using some 3240 02:31:06,229 --> 02:31:03,539 metals now that we never used before the 3241 02:31:09,889 --> 02:31:06,239 Navy is entirely dependent on zirconium 3242 02:31:13,250 --> 02:31:09,899 whoever heard of using zirconium the Air 3243 02:31:16,250 --> 02:31:13,260 Force uses a lot of titanium uranium was 3244 02:31:19,279 --> 02:31:16,260 used as a colouring agent for tableware 3245 02:31:21,350 --> 02:31:19,289 a hundred years ago that's illegal now 3246 02:31:25,280 --> 02:31:21,360 but better had 3247 02:31:28,280 --> 02:31:25,290 nuclear guy but what I'm saying is the 3248 02:31:29,960 --> 02:31:28,290 reasons for traveling can be varied and 3249 02:31:33,290 --> 02:31:29,970 different have changed with time 3250 02:31:35,030 --> 02:31:33,300 depending on the situations and a new 3251 02:31:36,770 --> 02:31:35,040 group of graduate students coming here 3252 02:31:38,870 --> 02:31:36,780 from someplace if professor says you 3253 02:31:41,960 --> 02:31:38,880 guys go out to that dumb planet over 3254 02:31:45,020 --> 02:31:41,970 there and check on the languages and why 3255 02:31:48,200 --> 02:31:45,030 is it that there are many different 3256 02:31:50,660 --> 02:31:48,210 colored skins over there what's with 3257 02:31:52,490 --> 02:31:50,670 that place any other hand you might say 3258 02:31:53,810 --> 02:31:52,500 that this is a penal colony they dumped 3259 02:31:55,280 --> 02:31:53,820 all the bad boys and girls here and 3260 02:31:59,840 --> 02:31:55,290 that's why we're so nasty to each other 3261 02:32:06,740 --> 02:31:59,850 who knows no one knows for sure well it 3262 02:32:09,080 --> 02:32:06,750 may be yes it could I'm just wondering 3263 02:32:11,480 --> 02:32:09,090 about the skeptics though I mean how 3264 02:32:14,540 --> 02:32:11,490 would the aliens be interacting with 3265 02:32:16,551 --> 02:32:14,550 skeptics or or egging them on to create 3266 02:32:18,560 --> 02:32:16,561 controversy you know that was part of 3267 02:32:21,051 --> 02:32:18,570 the question it really kind of I don't 3268 02:32:24,170 --> 02:32:21,061 know sort of made me scratch my head I 3269 02:32:29,000 --> 02:32:24,180 did have a skeptic come to me one time 3270 02:32:32,900 --> 02:32:29,010 he was sort of thrashing me out on the 3271 02:32:35,780 --> 02:32:32,910 internet and he wrote to me and he told 3272 02:32:38,330 --> 02:32:35,790 me that he was actually an experiencer 3273 02:32:42,890 --> 02:32:38,340 and I just couldn't figure that one out 3274 02:32:46,330 --> 02:32:42,900 why an experiencer would be so nasty and 3275 02:32:50,810 --> 02:32:46,340 hostile about the possibility that of 3276 02:32:53,900 --> 02:32:50,820 visitation it made no sense to me but to 3277 02:32:58,720 --> 02:32:53,910 think that perhaps all of these dis 3278 02:33:01,340 --> 02:32:58,730 informants are under alien mind control 3279 02:33:09,200 --> 02:33:01,350 really I don't think so 3280 02:33:12,020 --> 02:33:09,210 it doesn't make sense to me well maybe 3281 02:33:13,520 --> 02:33:12,030 the evil Reptoids are working on the 3282 02:33:16,520 --> 02:33:13,530 skeptics and their benevolent space 3283 02:33:20,511 --> 02:33:16,530 brothers or the antithesis of their 3284 02:33:22,430 --> 02:33:20,521 agenda so I just love that the create 3285 02:33:26,660 --> 02:33:22,440 the creativity of that question though 3286 02:33:28,340 --> 02:33:26,670 yes here's a good one and because we are 3287 02:33:30,809 --> 02:33:28,350 running out of time I think this is a 3288 02:33:32,699 --> 02:33:30,819 very good question for both of you 3289 02:33:35,099 --> 02:33:32,709 again comes from Randall up in Calgary 3290 02:33:37,019 --> 02:33:35,109 what do you think the most important 3291 02:33:40,109 --> 02:33:37,029 thing is that you follow just can do to 3292 02:33:43,439 --> 02:33:40,119 help bring credibility to the field well 3293 02:33:46,550 --> 02:33:43,449 we we say it in the book you know stick 3294 02:33:48,989 --> 02:33:46,560 to the facts be careful what you say 3295 02:33:51,210 --> 02:33:48,999 check things out get first-hand 3296 02:33:53,159 --> 02:33:51,220 information we talked about this at the 3297 02:33:55,979 --> 02:33:53,169 last Mew fund conference our papers and 3298 02:33:57,710 --> 02:33:55,989 the proceedings it's mostly Cathy's 3299 02:34:01,939 --> 02:33:57,720 paper but I added a few things about 3300 02:34:05,639 --> 02:34:01,949 rules for ufologists get first-hand data 3301 02:34:08,969 --> 02:34:05,649 don't come secure your ideas out without 3302 02:34:11,790 --> 02:34:08,979 having some evidence to support them at 3303 02:34:15,689 --> 02:34:11,800 least try not to make it they come like 3304 02:34:18,869 --> 02:34:15,699 top of the head stuff and I think we 3305 02:34:22,729 --> 02:34:18,879 need to be careful I find too few people 3306 02:34:26,040 --> 02:34:22,739 going to archives get the documents 3307 02:34:28,559 --> 02:34:26,050 archivists are very helpful I wanted 3308 02:34:30,510 --> 02:34:28,569 somebody who was there when Truman was 3309 02:34:32,880 --> 02:34:30,520 president I asked the Truman archives 3310 02:34:34,439 --> 02:34:32,890 they gave me the name of George Elsie he 3311 02:34:36,599 --> 02:34:34,449 worked for Truman whole time there's at 3312 02:34:38,550 --> 02:34:36,609 the White House he was a great help to 3313 02:34:41,699 --> 02:34:38,560 me in evaluating things about the 3314 02:34:44,040 --> 02:34:41,709 National Security Council mj-12 for that 3315 02:34:45,960 --> 02:34:44,050 matter but I can't find anybody else who 3316 02:34:49,170 --> 02:34:45,970 talked to him he's dead no no you can't 3317 02:34:51,329 --> 02:34:49,180 have him as a guest you know some people 3318 02:34:54,659 --> 02:34:51,339 might say we can't have him as a guest 3319 02:34:56,729 --> 02:34:54,669 well yeah you can have anybody do that I 3320 02:34:58,710 --> 02:34:56,739 mean he also became president of the 3321 02:35:01,699 --> 02:34:58,720 American Red Cross or maybe give you 3322 02:35:05,399 --> 02:35:01,709 some some tips about that sort of stuff 3323 02:35:11,189 --> 02:35:05,409 he was a big help to me but first hand 3324 02:35:14,939 --> 02:35:11,199 first him not 13 not fourth hand about 3325 02:35:17,729 --> 02:35:14,949 mental and never want to look at his 3326 02:35:20,369 --> 02:35:17,739 papers I agree with Stan that it's very 3327 02:35:24,649 --> 02:35:20,379 important to do your research to have 3328 02:35:28,800 --> 02:35:24,659 your facts in hand the dis informants 3329 02:35:31,439 --> 02:35:28,810 did their job through speculation some 3330 02:35:34,069 --> 02:35:31,449 ufologists do their job through 3331 02:35:37,529 --> 02:35:34,079 speculation they ask a lot of what-if 3332 02:35:40,889 --> 02:35:37,539 questions without ever going to the 3333 02:35:43,700 --> 02:35:40,899 factual information that we have and 3334 02:35:46,670 --> 02:35:43,710 that factual information is 3335 02:35:50,840 --> 02:35:46,680 in fact fiction and flying saucers if 3336 02:35:52,670 --> 02:35:50,850 you want to have a credible reputation 3337 02:35:55,160 --> 02:35:52,680 if you want to be considered credible in 3338 02:35:57,950 --> 02:35:55,170 this field it's very important that you 3339 02:36:00,469 --> 02:35:57,960 can back up your statements with facts a 3340 02:36:03,770 --> 02:36:00,479 little bit of speculation might be okay 3341 02:36:06,440 --> 02:36:03,780 but if you've stated this I'm 3342 02:36:08,960 --> 02:36:06,450 speculating forget it you're not willing 3343 02:36:11,960 --> 02:36:08,970 to be considered credible you have to 3344 02:36:15,140 --> 02:36:11,970 state I think very you'll be very out 3345 02:36:17,810 --> 02:36:15,150 front when you're hypothesizing or 3346 02:36:20,960 --> 02:36:17,820 speculating and sometimes that line gets 3347 02:36:24,650 --> 02:36:20,970 blurred I think too much actually lately 3348 02:36:26,540 --> 02:36:24,660 where things are stated as fact when in 3349 02:36:29,480 --> 02:36:26,550 fact they're not they're their opinions 3350 02:36:31,820 --> 02:36:29,490 or speculation and that's something that 3351 02:36:35,510 --> 02:36:31,830 I personally have really bent over 3352 02:36:38,750 --> 02:36:35,520 backwards to state things that are 3353 02:36:40,580 --> 02:36:38,760 factual as facts and whenever I go off 3354 02:36:43,610 --> 02:36:40,590 and say well what does that suggest then 3355 02:36:45,560 --> 02:36:43,620 then I go into the realm of hypothesis 3356 02:36:48,070 --> 02:36:45,570 but to make a clear delineation between 3357 02:36:50,540 --> 02:36:48,080 the two I think is really important 3358 02:36:53,330 --> 02:36:50,550 unfortunately going back to the you know 3359 02:36:56,990 --> 02:36:53,340 the whole issue of hard data and 3360 02:36:59,390 --> 02:36:57,000 actually hard copies of data I think 3361 02:37:00,950 --> 02:36:59,400 it's really important for people that 3362 02:37:03,800 --> 02:37:00,960 are new to the field and had not been 3363 02:37:07,640 --> 02:37:03,810 coming to remember that the history of 3364 02:37:11,540 --> 02:37:07,650 ufology has occurred pre-internet from a 3365 02:37:14,560 --> 02:37:11,550 lot then then we've had the internet at 3366 02:37:17,510 --> 02:37:14,570 our disposal visit your archives 3367 02:37:19,460 --> 02:37:17,520 absolutely if people want to learn more 3368 02:37:23,469 --> 02:37:19,470 about what Kathleen Martin is up to 3369 02:37:29,540 --> 02:37:23,479 where do we go you can go to Kathleen - 3370 02:37:33,860 --> 02:37:29,550 Mardon ma rden comm Stan Stanton 3371 02:37:37,310 --> 02:37:33,870 Friedman comm I also have a Facebook 3372 02:37:41,240 --> 02:37:37,320 page just look up my name you can find 3373 02:37:44,180 --> 02:37:41,250 us on Twitter look for the power cast 3374 02:37:47,570 --> 02:37:44,190 we're on Facebook - to power cast fan 3375 02:37:49,400 --> 02:37:47,580 clubs a community and a group and you 3376 02:37:53,480 --> 02:37:49,410 can't combine them so that's where they 3377 02:37:55,100 --> 02:37:53,490 are we also have a special version of 3378 02:37:56,349 --> 02:37:55,110 this show without the commercials to 3379 02:37:58,900 --> 02:37:56,359 offer to subscribe 3380 02:38:03,490 --> 02:37:58,910 of the para cast plus go to plus doctor 3381 02:38:06,760 --> 02:38:03,500 para cast calm PL us dot the para cast 3382 02:38:09,910 --> 02:38:06,770 calm we include the exclusive after the 3383 02:38:12,610 --> 02:38:09,920 para cast podcast which is gonna be real 3384 02:38:16,179 --> 02:38:12,620 fascinating this week as we begin to set 3385 02:38:20,380 --> 02:38:16,189 it up starting to add videos we'll have 3386 02:38:23,080 --> 02:38:20,390 show transcripts book excerpts classic 3387 02:38:25,480 --> 02:38:23,090 episodes for a low subscription rate if 3388 02:38:28,599 --> 02:38:25,490 you subscribe for five years or a 3389 02:38:31,599 --> 02:38:28,609 lifetime we give away free ebooks and 3390 02:38:34,960 --> 02:38:31,609 other special offers are coming PL us 3391 02:38:39,219 --> 02:38:34,970 dot the para cast comm that's plus dot 3392 02:38:41,200 --> 02:38:39,229 the para cast dot-com so guys we never 3393 02:38:42,880 --> 02:38:41,210 got it done today we got so much more to 3394 02:38:45,460 --> 02:38:42,890 talk about let's have you on again in 3395 02:38:47,290 --> 02:38:45,470 the future Stanton Friedman Kathleen 3396 02:38:50,400 --> 02:38:47,300 Martin thank you both for joining us on 3397 02:39:02,551 --> 02:38:50,410 the para cast my pleasure 3398 02:39:09,100 --> 02:39:06,071 the para cast featuring gene Steinberg 3399 02:39:11,970 --> 02:39:09,110 and Christopher O'Brien is a copyrighted 3400 02:39:15,701 --> 02:39:11,980 presentation of making the impossible